This is Culver’s. They’re a burger fast food joint located throughout the Midwest and have things called “Scoopy Night” where a percentage of the proceeds go toward a specific cause. Schools, dance groups, etc can partake and the kids who attend that school/dance group/etc help take orders and deliver food to tables. Not quite as dystopian as OP has made it seem.
For a few hours? Sure, why not. They’re not actually useful labor. The store is doing you a favor. Your average 8 year old peeled away from Minecraft and told to do a task is going to fuck up more than they help. I know, because I was that kid and I fucked up a lot. Sometimes in very expensive ways. My only worry would be that they would leave the job thinking every day will be fresh and new like that day, and that people are gracious and polite.
For a few weeks? Oh hell yes, now we’re talking. Then they’ll see the monotony and how much corporate sucks. Even more, how much customers suck. At that point, the value of learning a skill that keeps you out of the fast food/retail mines will be obvious.
Yes, of course I would. It's a great experience. We actually did that back in school, had a week when we all went out to check out different jobs. It was a great thrill and fun for all. Certainly not labor. We got to do grownup things. That was shortly before seventh grade, iirc.
And then, we've had school things where we would bake and cook and sell it right there on campus. Is that labor as well? Oh, and when I was in the boy scouts, we sometimes went door to door raising funds and selling trinkets. Child labor?
It's not like we had to do eight-hour days, week for week. A few hours, once in your life. That's not labor. That's a fun thing to do.
Depends on the kid. Do they treat workers disrespectfully, or not understand that money shouldn't be recklessly spent? Absolutely have them work fast food for a night -- so long as an adult is there to make sure there's no safety issues and they're paid full minimum wage for it, I'm all for it.
I had a chemistry teacher in high school who maintained that everyone should have to work retail or fast food once, and as I've grown older I completely understand what they meant. Some people are naturally not dicks. They don't look down on workers at Walmart or McDonald's. For others, it's a lesson they have to learn. They need to work in that position to understand what it's like.
That doesn't mean we should draft all kindergarteners into the work force. But the occasional experience to show them what a minimum wage job is like? Absolutely. If we want kids to grow up voting for minimum wage increases and universal labor rights, they have to learn these things somehow.
No, that's still idiotic. It doesn't matter what the context is of why a child is working at a fast food restaurant. There's a child working at a fast food restaurant. This isn't selling chocolates to raise money for a class hamster.
Being intent on remaining outraged is idiotic. Spending a few hours doing a handful of minor tasks at a fast food restaurant for fun is worlds apart from being required to labor for day after day for a pay check.
Selling chocolates is so much worse though. That always creeped me out because it’s either A) kids learning how to hawk wares on the street outside of stores, B) kids learning how to be door-to-door cold call solicitors or C) run a MLM pyramid scheme by convincing their parents to push their product at work.
Maybe even D) a combination of all of those for the ultimate street hustler training.
This is just kids “playing house” for a few hours. Most probably love that shit. I would have killed to see what the buttons on the register do and how the fries are made.
This is what it is, and it's sad that it's so normalized that people are defending it.
Everyone knows the kids aren't technically required, but they're "required" by social pressure.
I remember having to go door to door selling things when I was a kid. It may have been voluntary in a technical sense, but I was pretty well mandated to do so if I wanted to be part of that group with my friends. And there was even more pressure from my mom and dad because they didn't want to be the family whose kid didn't do the thing.
I think it's time we start taking a long hard look at some of these things like fundraisers and de facto coerced employment of youth (without pay) and ask ourselves if a healthy system would allow this.
It’s indicative of a larger effort by republicans to force children back to work, this is part of that dystopia even if it’s on the “light dystopia” side of the spectrum.
Fuck off whiteknight, keep enabling corporate’s ability to normalize and capitalize off of child labor. This ain’t no goddamn bake sale or car wash.
It's a fundraiser likely for an after school program. It typically pays out a lot better than a car wash or brat fry. Typically the students run orders out to cars.
And yeah, we probably should put more funding into schools for stuff like this instead of asking kids to fundraise.
Yea it makes it worse tbh. We won't fund fun things at the schools so instead we make them work fast food to earn that funding.
It is indeed even more dystopian when you put it like that. It's got the same energy as people giving their coworker PTO so they can deliver a baby or whatever.
when we needed to do fundraisers THE PARENTS IN THE PTA DID IT FOR THE MIDDLE SCHOOLERS.
We had plenty of 'kids' working at fast food and grocery stores but not until 15 minimum. this kid looks like he's 9. that's too young to be fucking around near fryers and hot grills.
I'm Australian and this reminds me of working at the local fish and.chip store when I was 12. I asked the local general store, but they'd only pay me to do odd jobs, the local bakery said no,.and the local fish and.chip shop said I could help take orders and.package meals during their busy hours each evening.
My Lego collection grew, I got real good at Time Crisis 3, and I went to see a movie each Saturday. It was awesome. I didn't see it any different to scoring cash for mowing lawns or washing cars, just stable and they appreciated my help so I felt good too.
If you'd told me I wasn't allowed, I'd have done it behind your back and said I was going to friend's houses.
The work itself wasn't important but learning responsibility and the value of money was important.
It was the first time I did anything completely on my own without being directed in some way by a parent, teacher, coach, etc. Without that job and after-school/summer jobs I had when I was older there is a good chance I would have made poor financial decisions in early adulthood.
With 18 year-olds getting credit cards shoved in their face the day they show up for orientation, after probably signing up for student loans, it's probably a good idea for them to have earned money on their own for a while.
I don't understand the people down voting you. Having a job growing up taught me a lot of responsibility and how to manage my own money and act in a professional environment. Invaluable skills that you wouldn't get anywhere else, certainly not school
These jobs you are speaking of--washing cars, mowing lawns, even kids working in their parents' store--do you think that is the same as working for a multinational conglomerate handling food with no breaks and minimum wage?
No they're not the same. The multinational conglomerate is far better.
Chores for the neighbors and the paper route paid peanuts. Once I was old enough to work for the conglomerate (where I received food safety training) my pay after taxes more than doubled (a little more than minimum wage, which did, and does, exist), I started contributing to my future social security check, I received paid breaks, and there was a maximum amount of hours I was legally allowed to work.
Flipping burgers beats the hell out of lugging Sunday papers around the neighborhood or knocking on doors to mow lawns in the summer heat or shovel driveways in the freezing cold. Back then I counted the days until I was old enough for a "real" job.
This is what I don't understand about all the angry people in this thread. Of course it's not okay to have children working in like fucking coal mines and not regulating the hours they can work and the pay you can give them. Of course that's not cool and should be stopped. But the people doing that (and there are many) aren't usually the ones doing it out in the open in a fast food restaurant.
All this constant hyperbole for every single issue is exhausting. No one is defending sending 13 years olds out to replace someone's roof. We're talking about "unskilled" labor like taking orders, stocking shelves, running registers etc.
Immigrant children are already being exploited and are dying doing roofing work. You want to put children in the workforce but they would not be safe. If we had a pilot program in place and had some successful results that would be a different situation, but we have kids working 30 feet in the air with no safety gear. https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2023/12/14/us/roofing-children-immigrants.html
Learning things a little at a time, when the stakes are low/non-existent is the way to go. From early teens to partway through college when you get an off campus apartment you can learn how to apply for a job, how to interview, responsibility, managing your money, responsible credit use, professionalism, bill paying. All this over the course of years, with a support system when you make mistakes (hopefully).
I guess some people think you should just have all that dropped on you like a ton of bricks the day after you get a diploma.
Your example is very extreme. Having an after school part time job as you're growing up will prepare you for quite a bit, and set us apart from our peers that didn't work, and instead wasted their days after school or on the weekends. I take it you never worked growing up ? It's building essential life skills, not inhaling noxious fumes working 16 hr days in mines, this isn't the 1800's. I loved flipping burgers and making a paycheck at 15
I wasn't sure where I stood on this and read a lot of comments.
One thing that seems common is that many of those who worked young seem to think it made them better than the other kids somehow. They "wasted" their summer, while you built "essential life skills" unlike the person you're replying to, who did not? Are you still "set apart" from the person you replied to?
I might think getting thrown into the system at a younger age is the real waste of life. I've had a job since I was 15, but I really don't think it made me better than anyone.
It didn't make me "better" but from talking to people I went to college with (that didn't get jobs early), I'd definitely say I was more prepared for the workforce.
Also having money was dope and my fast food job was fun. I still enjoyed my life and summer outside of work, even more so because I could afford to do and get shit that my parents might not have been able to give me. It's not an all or nothing deal it's just a different life experience. I think it would be infantilizing to take the choice away from teenagers, though it is important to regulate it as shitty people will take advantage of it.
I think there's a line somewhere and for me the line is whether the job is suitable for children. Like, doing chores around the house or on your grandparents' farm. Paper route riding a bike. I worked summers at a carnival, and at a pool when I was a bit older. Low physical labor, low responsibility, low customer interaction, family friendly environments. You're right it should never interfere with education.
If I saw a kid at the register of a fast food place or a store, I would turn around immediately and never return. Just leaves a bad taste in one's mouth.
First of all, I generally agree with you that child labor such as in the OP is bad.
That being said, responding to people who had positive experiences with it in their own lives by jumping directly to sending then to the mines is absolutely fucking insane. They are not the same thing.
I think children should be free to focus on more important things than working.
"Freedom" to do what you want them to and nothing more, not even to earn it over summer break or learn the value of money.
Fuck 'em, just wait until they get out of highschool at 18 before they ever even see real money and have no idea how any of it works, who the predators are, and what the risk is.
Fuck 'em, just wait until they get out of highschool at 18 before they ever even see real money and have no idea how any of it works, who the predators are, and what the risk is.
Why is this worse than the literal same thing at a younger age?
This place is insane sometimes. In their heads they're thinking children being forced into labor, obviously that's not what we're talking about here. I had various gigs I did as a kid to earn some extra money, snow shoveling in the winter, mowing in the summer, I'm doing much better financially than my peers. Most of the guys I was in the military with were losing their whole paychecks just days after getting them, never having that much money in their lives. No one ever taught them and they never developed the skills on their own.
Say what you will, but I don't think there's anything wrong with letting a kid work in an entrepreneur kind of fashion or in limited capacity like what you did on weekends, summer break, etc.
You can't raise someone into an adult if you hand them the keys for the first time on their 18th birthday. Most of us learn by doing and it's best to get the hands on experience.
Sometimes I read comments online and initially think they're sarcastic but then realise the person's serious and flexing way above their capacity, usually by straw manning. And here's one of those moments...
Do you think we should send the kids back to the mines?
facepalm
About as much as you think the police should be shutting down lemonade stands.
I don't know why, but paper boys (yes we were all boys) were some sort of exception to child labour laws. I was selling newspapers when I was 12-13 for 5c ea.
And what about those assholes that never wanted to pay? Just pay the kid you cheap ass. I see your cars, your lights are on, I know you're home motherfucker.
I identified so hard with that "I want my two dollars" kid from Better Off Dead.
One of my customers went and died owing me 80c. I just took the loss. But it would have been hilarious to see some young kid chasing the estate for his debt!
I'm American and I totally agree. It feels like there are two different countries here, with the red one generally mooching off of the blue one while simultaneously claiming they're the "real America". I'm so tired.
There's hardly anything to defend because there's nothing here other than a photo with zero confirmed information about what appears in the photo. People are just making baseless assumptions.
I.e. your locally owned mom-and-pop Chinese takeout. I’ve seen the kiddos answer the phones there a couple of times, tho most of the time when picking up food for the wife they’re just playing in a blocked off side area that used to be dining pre-pandemic.
Yeah, I agree it's fucked up but there's almost no way that kid's under 14, which is the youngest age Culver's will hire at, he's just a late bloomer probably. I think a lot of people would disagree with calling that age group a "literal child."
I don't think most people would disagree that "teenager" is a more accurate word to describe that age. Trust me, there is plenty fucked up with the OP picture, we don't need to resort to hyperbolic language to get our point across.
Its not hyperbolic, 14 is a teenage child. Teenager is not more accurate, because when you say a 'teenage worker' most would assume they were at least in the usually accepted 'young adult' range, 16-19, the image here is of a child worker. If they were 17 or 16 that might be different, though still literally, legally a child.
I don't think most people would disagree that "teenager" is a more accurate word to describe that age. Trust me, there is plenty fucked up with the OP picture, we don't need to resort to hyperbolic language to get our point across.
It is blatantly the opposite of accurate. When teenager describes both a thirteen year old who hasn't hit puberty and a nineteen year old who could fight and die for their country, it's obviously not an accurate enough term
Assuming the literal meaning of “literal”, a child is, according to the OED, literally:
a young human being below the age of puberty or below the legal age of majority.
I'm not in any way defending child labor in general or Culvers in particular, but factually speaking, a 14-year-old fits between those two definitions (above the age of puberty but below the legal age of majority).
So that's an inclusive "or" in the definition. If EITHER of those criteria are fulfilled, then the definition can be applied. Since the criterion about the age of majority is true then the definition is true.
So conversely, a person above the age of majority who hasn't reached puberty yet (medical condition maybe? Just suspend disbelief for the sake of the argument) is still by definition a child.
I have a 14 year old right now and I’d have zero issues with him getting a job. He’s already been eyeing some places. I know this isn’t what you’re exactly saying, but once they hit puberty they’re a bit different than young kids.
I respect that, but your 14 year old is probably quite unusual in that respect. To his credit, of course! Some kids mature faster, and in different areas at different rates. I have a 13 year old and a 16 year old and neither of them would be capable of paid work in my opinion. I love them from the bottom of my heart but they would crumble after a shift at BK
I got my first job in ‘95 when I was 13. This was in a Toronto suburb at a computer shop and it was awesome although only got $5 an hour and had to stay in the back mostly shrink-wrapping a million cd cases. There was a cute 16 year old older girl at the register that I still remember lol.
Didn’t love wearing a large Windows ‘95 box costume and standing at the corner like a hooker though.
Jeeziz. We're about the same age and I was unable to even make a sandwich at that age I think. Mind you, I bet 13 year old you was ecstatic about that 5 dollars an hour in 1995. I hope you've got a picture of yourself in that box for the laughs.
My first job was call centre work at 16. I answered an advert in the local paper. Trying to use a script to swindle old ladies out of their pension for a commission, it was horrifying. I remember thinking "is this what adults do for a living? Cheat each other??" Looking back, I wasn't that far off in a lot of cases I think.
Oh man that’s a terrible first job lol. I would absolutely hate doing that.
By the time I was 16 I had moved to the states and got a job at KB Toys at the mall. They paid 7.75 an hour which was better than the rest of the mall at 5.25 an hour. Mall was the place to be though!
I liked service work. I tended bar and worked in kitchens for years while I got my qualifications. I sometimes think everyone should have to do retail or service for a bit so they can meet as many different types of people as possible. I work in research now, and I see a lot of the graduates coming in in their twenties and they don't understand shit about how the world works, or how people work. I think there's a lot of value in the experience you get in those jobs that people look down their noses at. If it paid the bills as well as science and engineering, I would've stayed.
Service work wasn’t bad at all. First service gig I had was when I was 18 and I worked a catering gig for a golf tournament. Thought I was practically a millionaire because it paid $20 an hour!
Went to college and waited tables at some restaurant named Pargos. Biggest tip I ever got was when I accidentally spilled an ice tea over the patriarch of an 8 top lol. I was mortified. I had been pledging a fraternity and got very little sleep before. Turns out the guy was also a fraternity alum so I got really lucky.
I completely agree with you. You learn so much dealing with customers and not to mention some interesting coworkers. That movie “Waiting” was pretty spot on.
I was laying lines blueberry raking at 14, and doing dishes in a restaurant at 16. I wanted money and it certainly taught me how difficult manual labor is without putting me in any real danger. The worst I got was bread cuts. I'd 100% put my daughter in the same situation when she's older.
Getting a job as an indulgence because they are interested is fine. Getting a job because their parents are not capable of giving them a dignified lifestyle is downright disgusting and such kids should be rescued. Often greedy parents mask the latter as the former because they are scum.
Getting a job because their parents are not capable of giving them a dignified lifestyle is downright disgusting and such kids should be rescued
I just don't understand this leap to conclusions that every young person is out there working because their parents aren't feeding or clothing them. I grew up with rich friends, middle class friends, and poor friends. Random assortments of all three groups grew up working. The vast majority of the time it to earn money for themselves to buy luxuries. One friend was working to support their family due to a parental situation. There's no way putting that person in the foster care system would have been better. They Graduated with decent grades too.
Don't get too worked up over it. The average Stay-At-Home-Lemmy is completely unable to understand the concept that not everyone's mom and dad will buy them an Xbox and that sometimes teenagers will get jobs to pay for things they want.
I enjoyed it. The work was easy and it gave me a sense of purpose and I needed that. It taught me the value of my time, and enabled me to get a car when I turned 16. Some people grow up fast, simply because they have to, or sometimes because they just, do. One size does not fit all.
I think many states allow children as young as 12 to work in specific non-dangerous jobs with permission from the parents. A company recently got in trouble when they had like 20 12-15 year olds working in a meat processing plant which definitely did not qualify for the "not dangerous" qualifier.
They do this often at the Culver's near me. It's a fundraiser for school / extracurricular activities. The group works for a few hours and Culver's donates the receipts for that time.
It's better than having them go door to door selling wreaths and shit.
The school is funded already through taxpayers. The fact that "the children are working to fund the school" is an acceptable line of logic is already dystopian.
Traditionally, children do fundraisers to fund extracurricular activities, like a field trip. If the school is taking that money to add to their budget, that's crossing the line into exploiting kids' labor for money.
Where do you live that public schools are properly funded by taxes? American schools are embarrassingly underfunded, and teachers are tragically underpaid and typically have to spend their own money to buy supplies for their students.
The fact that public schools used to be properly funded by taxes and aren't any longer is part of the dystopia. Do you think I'm defending the current system?
I was surprised to find out how much the U.S. actually does spend on education, given how shitty it is. Idk where the money is going, but it's definitely funded
Part of this comes from the fact that most public schools are funded from local property taxes, so naturally wealthier residents have better public schools due to better funding as they naturally pay more in taxes
Most School systems are financially gutted to the bone. It's dark but most red counties school districts are near bankruptcy and blue areas are slightly better off. So expect more of this as public schools try to keep the doors open.
When looking at homes in the more rural areas I noticed that the schools basically shoved all the kids from a good bit around different towns and areas into one. I’d guess to consolidate as much funds as possible in an effective manner, rather than having to pay for more infrastructure that was really needed.
While I would have liked the slower pace….all I could afford out that way were 100 year old farmhouses with very questionable bones. One you could literally walk the dip between the kitchen and living room. Another had electric, propane and fireplaces for the heating in different areas of the home. Had to tell my wife to stop looking at those.
I remember having school assemblies in middle school with some third party fundraising company trying to get us to sell...I don't even remember what as a fundraiser for the entire school. At the time it felt weird and as an adult looking back I find it far more concerning that that's how they made up the budget shortfalls instead of raising property taxes by fraction of a percent
I had to help out behind the register at a mcdonald's for a scout thing, I was supposed to upsell coupon books. I spent about 2 hours standing next to a teenage girl who calmly stood there and took a near non stop stream of abuse from entitled idiots. People got mad at her when the kitchen messed up their order. They got upset at her over price changes since their last visit. They got mad at her when an item was missing out of a 4-bag $80 order (they unbagged and checked everything there on the counter). One particular piece of shit actually got mad because the girl didn't recognize him and know his usual order as he was in there a lot, according to him. That one really blew my top. The casual way in which people were awful to the cashier just blew my mind.
They got mad at her when an item was missing out of a 4-bag $80 order (they unbagged and checked everything there on the counter).
That one seems valid. That person got burned before with the staff not bothering to do their job and were NOT going to short their friend whatever item(s) the staff kept for themselves. Sure, you can say the counter girl didn't do the bagging, but she's the one that the customer is supposed to tell, and it is hard not to be angry when you've paid for stuff and you're getting shorted -- AND there's almost surely another person relying on you to get it right this time. It shouldn't take so much effort to just get the stuff you paid for.
it's definitely not valid. Anyone getting upset at fast food workers just doing their jobs can get fucked. They could have resolved the issue without being assholes, she was nothing but polite to them and it wasn't her fuckup.
... but they WEREN'T doing their job. I've been a counter cashier at a burger joint. Most of the job was getting the order correct and taking in money properly, but I also has to to things like add extra relish packets and see that I was giving them the correct food. That's the job. You give the customer what they ordered. That is the EASY part. The hard part is dealing with the people trying to scam you with bill-switching/wrong-change schemes (though I suspect those are less common as fewer people use cash now).
That's true, but I don't know how much of a stink was made. If someone is unbagging everything at the counter, they've probably been burned before, so I can see some reason to take a harsh tone -- enough to show they're tired of the BS. If, instead, they started throwing things and screaming obscenities, yeah, that'd be an overreaction.
This kid is way too young to be taking verbal abuse from customers. I remember being 19-but-looked-15 and grown-ass adult customers calling me stupid and useless, and generally speaking to and looking at me like I was a piece of dung stuck to the bottom of their shoe. People who thought I was a literal child behaved this way. Not to mention all the perverts. Kids shouldn’t be working customer service, not in a world where adults have such disgusting behavior.
I'm sorry that this all happened to you. I know this happened in the past, but you deserve a little hug. I hope things are better for you on a day to day basis. ♥
Thanks, that's sweet of you. <3 Things are much better for me now that I'm out of that line of work, so I do my best to stand up to trashy customers on behalf of the people who can't.
Nah, you got the wrong end of the stick, this is an uplifting story - it's a kid working hard to provide for his mum's cancer treatment that in any other developed nation would be covered by taxes. Uplifting. Right? So Uplifting. He doesn't need to be with his mum in her time of need, he should be suckin that capitalist dick.
I work in the Media Center of a High School. Some 9th and even a few 10th graders definitely look like they still belong in middle school, some kids mature late. I’d totally believe that there’s a possibility this person is actually at least 14.
I'd argue that kids are not fit for the stress put on people in service positions with customer contact. It's fine if they have a holiday job cutting grass or delivering newspapers or something like that but standing behind a counter taking orders from people that often don't even acknowledge that you're human, too? That's hard enough on adults already - I definitely don't think it's the kind of job for kids.
Also which business is hiring kids to work a couple of weeks during school holidays and then is fine having one less worker again? The time spent on teaching the child what to do and how to handle different situations as well as the paperwork probably takes more time and money than not having the help for a couple of weeks - even less so as you probably have to have another person nearby in case of customers overstepping so I'm not sure this is just some holiday job for the kid to earn pocket money or get job experience
You'd think so, but people can be downright cruel to those they think are 'under' them, and guess what every person working a job that can't get them fired (so no business-to-business contacts) is to them?
I remember working in a customer facing role when I was a teen, and occasionally had to tell people the place was closed due to weather. They would accuse me of being everything under the sun and personally on a vendetta to make their lives miserable... and there was nothing I could do about it aside from calling the police if they actually started making threats.
I've always been about kids getting out there early and getting a taste of working, but these days feel different. I wouldn't want to go back into customer service now and I've got experience and age to back be up in dealing with customers.
I do think that people who cause the disruptive behavior that I'm referring to should be required to serve time doing those jobs, as I think part of their entitlement is ignorance of what's it's like behind the counter.
I mean service jobs are never great, but most of my jobs from 14 through early adulthood were all service and they weren't that bad.
You encounter plenty of rude and unpleasant people, but you just get on with it. It's not traumatic for the vast majority of people. Learning to handle people like that is a good skill to have.
I totally agree that people would be better to each other if everyone had so service job experience.
Waiting tables at the tail end of high school and throughout college really boosted my intrapersonal skills. I have no problem interacting with most anyone and can usually pick up on cues that go beyond what the person is saying. I work in engineering at a fortune 500 now it's really amusing how bad a decent swath of employees are at getting their point across, understanding what someone else is trying to tell them, and reading the room.
That said, I had a stint in retail. Waiting tables was more stress, but the people were generally quite a bit nicer.
I worked at an Arcade/Restaurant when I was 13 for 25-30 hours a week. It was absolutely a positive experience for me and it's a shame to see so many people here crucify the idea of any child working at that age. Y'all haven't the slightest idea whats the motivation and just assume they are being forced into it or something. Having a job so young built character and showed me that I was able to get the things I wanted in life if I put in the 'hard' work. Nobody forced me to work those hours, I wanted to! Props to Culver's for providing the opportunity to kids.
Yup. I was picking up lawn mowing accounts when I was 12-13, and it was the best feeling in the world buying myself the jeep that I wanted two weeks before I turned 16.
I agree 100% but working fast food is very different than an after school work opportunity, come on now.
I never got an allowance and worked after school jobs alt the elementary/hs/uni but that is a far cry from what some of the child laborers are starting to do here in the US.
Normalizing this sort of thing is problematic, it’s not about the kid working for money it’s about the setting and expectations of both the employees and the customers. They should be focused on education and being a kid, but they can’t do that when they spend their afternoons at the factory
I had my own computer and car before I turned 18, and it felt empowering to have accomplished this on my own. You and I have drastically different views on what's exploitative. Full stop.
Child labor laws weren't meant to protect someone like you, they're meant to stop folks from sending their kids to work to pay their rent/mortgage/power/water. Kids should know that paying their parents bills is not ideal, and child labor laws are how we protect them. Without revealing too much about myself, my dad was one of [large number] of children, and they absolutely used those kids for labor at the family farm and were worse off for it. They grew up in poverty (on top of the physical abuse). Basically, these laws aren't supposed to stop young Timmy from buying a [insert gadget here], they're to stop Mom from pulling him out of school for an extra shift because she overdrew her bank account.
There's no way that kid is 13, by the way. Far too young for working the register at Culver's. At least they don't have him at the deep fryer. If the other comment I see in this thread is to be believed (the one that says this is a Manager's child and school was closed), it's probably not as nefarious as it seems. Republican states have been in the news fighting against child labor laws though, people are rightly outraged about that.
Aye you're right I should have specified. 25-30 hours a week was only during the summer months. During the school year it was 10-20 hours, and mostly on weekends. The US has strict laws on what children of that age can work during school days.
For one, we have no idea if it's completely unrelated. We don't know any of the context here just from the picture. This could very well be a summer job. We don't know.
Also, nonce is a really weird insult. Are you meaning to call them an idiot, or a pedo? If the former, sure, but if the latter, that's really weird.
The kid in the picture looks under 13. We all thought he's not high school, lol.
I'm not American but i saw a South Park episode poking fun of children working, as those older refuse to work under bad pay and toxic working condition as the result of pandemic. Is there any truth to this despite the satire?
When I was 13 I was 'encouraged' by my family to get a job. I had no interest. They pulled some strings and I began illegally working (14 was the legal age) for a small family diner. At this time I just wanted to fiddle on my tech as I was very nerdy, but my family didn't want me to "stay in my room all the time," so pointless labour it was.
I did appreciate the liberation I gained from my family, even if I didn't have the knowledge of what to do with it; How to expand upon it. Probably for the best imo. I spent my whole first paycheck on some games that me and my homies would play in the garage and made great memories. If there was a life lesson to be learned during this whole experience, I never understood it at the time. Eventually I was let go from work since no-one taught me how to perform my job duties well enough. That's life, though!
By luck, one of my caring high-school teachers managed to slip-in his own curriculum. He taught a class of ~15 students some important financial skills... how mortgages work... how to create and manage savings... credit building... Bunch of important life stuff that I would consider essential knowledge in our society was an optional course I learned through word-of-mouth/happenstance.
???
why
Meanwhile and my ultimate gripe with this thread and tying this back into a dystopian - I see some people mention they learned valuable life lessons and a bunch of other copium. Witness me and your kin around you. Is the knowledge you gained - the wisdom acquired through action and experience - is it gained through labour? No. I didn't and others didn't either. Can it be taught safely without forcing children with a young developing brain into dangerous work environments? Yes. I gained such wisdom later from the safety and comfort of my school. And we rest on the final point with a question:
How many opportunities in the common layman eye are there for children to receive education on the matter?
If your experience had 1 or more, I'd love for you to share such experiences here as it's eye-opening to those who received and did not receive such privilege. I'm certainly interested! :)
As someone who was pulled out of school at 14 and sent to work rebuilding old houses and breaking my back for $100 a week, education is where it’s at.
Appalachia is a whole different world (especially 25-30 years ago, the internet is changing it though).
The dude I worked for was molesting little girls and using the boys to stand up for him in court later to talk about how great he was. Unfortunately (for him that is) he made some mistakes and didn’t get our support, but boy he tried.
I remember one time he took us to the lake. He said, “I’m psychic, you know. I know things that no one else knows.” I replied, “there’s no such thing. Prove it.” He said, “Ok, when you and Regina sat on the train tracks and you ate her pussy and she sucked your dick. I just seen that in my mind.” He blew my mind in that moment.
I grew up and realized, Regina put my penis in her mouth because someone was teaching her that shit. I put my mouth on her vagina because she instructed me to do it. She did so because someone taught her this stuff. We were 11 and 9.
I know that’s disturbing and I’m sorry.
Kids shouldn’t be handed over to strange adults to work. If I’m not proof of that I don’t know what is.
Legal working age of 15 1/2 (in my state) plus a kid who looks young for their age - may not be the most appealing situation, bit this probably completely above board.
No age restrictions if family owned business, that's a federal law no state can bypass, but I doubt the owner of Culver's needs their kids to work to support the family.
That's a federal law aimed at farm families from back in the day. And farm kids are still helping and working along side Grandpa and Dad. And where I live, in the middle of a forest, they also help and work along side in logging families also.
Growing up on a farm, my earliest memory in life is walking behind a tractor pulling a 'stoneboat' and picking up rocks in the fields along side my father and grandfather. I was driving a tractor pulling wagons and hay trailers by 8 years old and by 12 I was driving trucks hauling grain from the field to storage bins and unloading them. Plus getting up a 5AM to help milk cows every morning and again at 5PM. It was absolutely crucial when my Grandfather got sick with "Farmer's Lung" and couldn't work much anymore. I pretty much started running his farm at 14.
Good reference to a great book. Anyone who hasn't read it, should. In a similar vein, anyone who hasn't watched the streaming adaptation with Martin Sheen and David Tennant is in for a very nice surprise!
I was stoked to have a job when I was 14 making smoothies. Legally I could only do 7 hours a week and I enjoyed it. It helped me learn about scheduling and being on time, and I saved up enough money to buy my own Xbox. People in this thread are idiots.
Yeah, minimum age in the US (most states) is 14 yrs old. I wanted a job so bad when I was a kid. I grew up super poor so I never had an allowance. I got a job as soon as a could and I could buy my own things.
My own kid also got a job early, I told them they didn't have to but they wanted to earn their own money (I was super proud of the reason). They worked for a few years, took a year or so off, then after graduating high school, bought their own car. I'm actually so proud of my kid. Kind of a smart ass sometimes but like... That's because they're me too. So like.. 🤙
I think the downvotes are because that kid looks a lot younger than 14, so this sentiment does not apply here.
I also don't have a problem with kids working jobs, but it has to be under very controlled circumstances to avoid exploitation. It's important to remember that children can't enter contracts (which is a requirement of any employment), and for good reason.
I think as well that the recent spike in news stories about kids being killed at jobs they shouldn't have been working in the first place is behind a lot of the sentiment here, so arguing that kids should be allowed to work while ignoring that context isn't going to be received well.
You seem to have missed the part about children being killed at jobs they shouldn't be working in the first place. I agree there shouldn't be a blanket ban on children working if certain requirements are met for safety, but if you're going to ignore the problems with what's actually happening and why people are upset about it then there's nothing more to the discussion.
I started at 15. First thing I purchased was a PS1 and Chrono Cross. I felt like I had everything. After that it became a steady stream of gas money and tossing in $10-$20 bucks with other friends to get some weed. I miss the easy days...
If there's reasonable legal maximum hours and legal minimum age then sure, otherwise it's just opening the door to child labour and that's a real problem that exists even in first world countries.
I started working at 15. The owner/manager of my first job would give the 15-17 year-old girls he hired drugs in exchange for sexual favors. Also had us work past legal hours and all the other normal exploitative shit people should expect.
Second job I had also had pedo managers. Asking us questions like, "what was the craziest places you had sex at?" during group orientation. I also had to dispute the hours I was paid for on nearly every paycheck I got.
I'm guessing experiences like this aren't universal, but the fact that my first 2 jobs as a child were very exploitative, it's probably not uncommon.
I think scheduling and being on time could be picked up quickly by adults.
