"Meanwhile, the New York Times Editorial Board did not ask Donald Trump to step down. Not after he was held liable for rape or fraud or defamation. Not after he was convicted on all 34 counts by a jury of his peers. Not even after he vomited lie after lie at the debate and refused to admit that he’d accept the results of the 2024 election."
@wdlindsy He's not dropping because his motivation is remaining out of jail. But Biden could step down to make sure tRump indeed goes to jail. It's up to him
@wdlindsy If current polls are to be heeded, American voters have already decided that they prefer the vile man that you mention over an honorable Biden, whose falling ratings have only been lowered further by his debate performance. Then, it is only Biden who might step aside for a younger, more appealing team that would answer the myriad of lies Trump spews whenever his mouth is open. Your point re:NY Times is spot on.
@wdlindsy It’s practically psychotic to see what is the Republican nominee for the top leadership position in the country. I can’t believe Biden didn’t say “Why the Hell am I up here debating a felon, womanizer, rapist, swindler, unrepentant Putin lapdog?” Can you even imagine our intelligent services having to share top-secret information with Mr. The Highest Bidder Wins? Oh yeah, he’s Mr. Immune. Can’t wait to see if SCOTUS has fucked us again. 🔥😬
@Huntn00 As your second sentence implies, Biden was placed — and by his campaign's choice — in an intolerable position in a pseudo-debate with an amoral, feral liar, with no safeguards even to check the person's lies.
What would the point be. With the Democrats, at least, they might pick someone better. The Republicans would probably pick someone just as bad or worse, probably one of the Gilead states governors.
@the5thColumnist I suspect the point of making these observations is not realistically to call Trump to step down, but to note to the glaring, dangerous, cynical way in which the US corporate media beat up constantly on Biden while giving convicted felon Donald Trump pass after pass.
@wdlindsy
Do think that just maybe another Democrat candidate would have a better chance of beating Trump?
Or that Trump is one of the best candidate to be fighting from the Dems perspective as he turns away moderate voters in droves?
Is Biden steps out the race now with some dignity he would get respect from people in and out of politics. If he keeps going, he is just going to keep getting older and having more 'senior moments'.
@wdlindsy@Colby You really have to separate the “news” NYT from the Editorial Board. I know it’s all the same ownership, but the EB, under the guise of independence, has historically always been allowed to roam free with its opinion. At least it’s not under the control of a major corporation, which can even slant news coverage (e.g., the WSJ).
@Bellaboo@Colby But I don't think you can really separate the journalistic side from the editorial side. Again and again, they've proven that the editorial slant mandated by their top managers and owners also affects how they frame and tell the news.
@wdlindsy@Colby I don’t terribly disagree, but if anything, I always thought the news choices and coverage always slanted left. I think the Biden statement was a panicked knee jerk by an organization that only saw trouble ahead of Trump got elected again.
@Bellaboo@Colby I agree that the political-cultural right in the US have long wanted us to imagine that the corporate media skew left. That leftist corporate media has proven, in my lifetime, about as visible as unicorns, however.
@wdlindsy Great point: “This absurd double standard reflects the utter asymmetry between both parties and how they are treated by our institutions. The bar is so low that Donald Trump merely has to slither underneath it”.
@wdlindsy
That needs to happen...
Can we organize phone calls ?
Let's get this together by Monday.
I will repeatedly beg people to start making phone calls several times a day.
Of course it would be better for almost everyone if Trump stepped down from the race rather than Biden.
We can ask Trump whatever we want. Since he has a dictatorial grip on the Republican Party, it will be ineffectual.
On the other hand, Biden is a good guy, who will presumably bow to the will of the Party and heed a good argument, if, and that is still a big IF, there is a charismatic candidate with a significantly better chance. The election isn't today or tomorrow so that may happen.
But "asking" Trump to leave the Race? That will have zero effect and we will just be deluding ourselves.
@hopfgeist I think you are reading what is meant as a rhetorical proposal as a realistic one. I think that in making this proposal, Left Hook is speaking rhetorically, knowing full well that Trump will not step down, but commenting on the huge inequity in how media mavens treat Biden in contrast to Trump.
@wdlindsy Ah yes, I think I see. Instead of discussing Biden's shortcoming, we should focus on how terrible Trump is, both compared to Biden and overall, not just for the US, but for the entire world (except perhaps a few dictators).
@hopfgeist Perhaps if you actually lived in the US and had your skin in the game and would suffer first and foremost the consequences of helping to place Trump back in the White House, you'd be less cavalier about recognizing that Trump, not Biden, is the problem.
Of course, a lot of those calling for Biden to step down and representing themselves as "concerned" about the Democrats' chances are actually promoting Trump.
@wdlindsy
I'm sorry if I was misunderstood. I wasn't at all sarcastic, or cavalier or ironic, or however you want to call it. Maybe that got lost in writing. I was dead serious.
I am very well aware of how terrible Trump would be, and, as I thought I wrote in my reply, I understand that it is paramount to prevent a second term for Trump, because even we in Europe would suffer, although perhaps not as much as the US.
And making sure Trump cannot be elected is certainly the most desirable way.
@wdlindsy If America is in such dire straits, according to the lying tRUmp, why are so many immigrants desperately trying to come to the US, be willing to endure major hardships, and become part of our great nation?
@wdlindsy The Times Editorial Board revealed themselves to be morally bankrupt. What won’t they do for a cheap headline. I guess the monied owners of the media are suppressing the gag reflex and quietly hedging their nets.
@N0tSure That's who they are, for sure, and why I have never subscribed to them. They wrote the book on arrogant obtuseness in service of their owning class.
@gimulnautti I'm not clear as to who you think is making a mistake. If you're referring to Left Hook, I don't read it's proposal for Trump to resign as sincere and realistic. Rather, I read it as commentary on the media's overweening way of holding Biden to impossible standards while giving Trump a passage at every turn.
@botahamec Sorry, but I don't see Biden as the problem.
I see Trump as the problem and the millions of Americans willing to vote for him — whose interests are served by tearing away at the only candidate the Democratic party has with the potential to beat Trump.
@wdlindsy Right now, I think Biden is the only candidate who can't beat Trump. Anybody else would've demolished Trump last night. If Biden gave a C+ performance at that debate, we'd all be talking about how bad Trump was. Trump was asked about climate change and said "We had H2O".
Biden, not even ten minutes into the debate, lost his train of thought three times in one sentence, and ended with "we finally beat Medicare". It didn't stop there.
@botahamec I well remember when the same sort of folks were sayinig this very same thing when Obama lost the "debate" in his first presidential election attempt.
I'll take spewing a firehose of lies as far worse than being an elderly man with a speech impediment having a bad night.
@wdlindsy Obama at his worst was ten times better than Biden was on Thursday. Not only was it the worst presidential debate in US history; it was the worst public appearance by a US president. And unlike with Obama, there's no strategy Biden can follow to improve for the next debate
I agree that Biden is a better president than Trump. If I were on that stage with Trump, I would say that, and I would win that debate. But Biden can't win that debate. If we keep Biden, we'll end up with Trump.
@botahamec I see. Your argument that Biden is worthless addressed his "debate" performance. But when I point out to you that Obama had an equally abysmal performance in his first campaign and the commentariat class freaked out just as they're doing about Biden now, you shift the discussion to an Obama-is-better discussion.
I'm going to continue focusing on Trump as the problem and not Biden.
@wdlindsy It was not equally abysmal. Obama against Romney was ten times better than Biden on Thursday.
I don't care who you think "the problem" is. I just need you to accept that if we continue on this path, Trump will likely win, and we need drastic action to ensure that's not true. Democrats, in general, are doing great right now. Biden isn't.
Nate Silver's model showed Biden had a 35% chance to win before the debate. With so much at stake, shouldn't we have a better candidate?
@Atirut I'm going to go with the deduction that the convicted felon with multiple criminal indictments who orchestrated an insurrection attempt is the one who is not good for America.
@wdlindsy maybe because Trumps a selfish narcissist who would never do the right thing whereas Biden may make the difficult call for the good of the country?
@RFarq I'm not reading Left Hook to be making a realistic proposal there, but to be offering rhetorical commentary to call into question the overwhelming anti-Biden bias in the corporate media.
@glennsills Left Hook is not making a proposal that anyone, including Left Hook, expects the Republican party seriously to consider. Left Hook is offering a rhetorical critique of the very different way the corporate media treat Biden in contrast to Trump.
@wdlindsy I think the reason behind this is that the Democrats don't stand a chance with Biden. Not because he is old or no longer in his right mind, but because he cannot compete with Trump and his supporters. and Trump's supporters really don't care that Trump is a criminal.