No fucking shit. You mean the same way the US has backed countless coups around the world, and was caught as recently as 2022 meddling with the governance of other countries? Color me surprised /s
Wanna know some of our biggest govt meddling? Remember when we got Adolph Hitler up outta there? How bout Mussolini in Italy? NK when they invaded SK? We actually get shit done while you cry on western made internet about it. Unless you'd prefer to have been governed by Taliban maybe you need to be "just as bad"
Manuel Zelaya, Salvador Allende, Fidel Castro, Aristide (oops, we fixed it though, all better now see?), a whole generation of North African warlords, Milošević, Afghanistan, Askar Akayev, Ismail Haniyeh...
After a certain point I started just copying from this article; there are plenty more. I won't say you're 100% wrong but neither is the person you're talking to, either.
What are you talking about? Those places all shit holes way before we involved ourself. Just because they're still shit holes after we leave doesn't make it our fault. Yea Fidel Castro? What about him? He wanted to hold nukes pointed at my country on behalf of another country which was balancing on a fine line of being called out enemy at the time? So we got him up outta there with that nonsense. What were we suppose to do?
Tankies just mad they failed at putting nukes right on our border and we made sure not to fail after they tried that bullshit. Look who has military bases stockpiled all around those dumbfucks now.
Yea because a place where some guy named "barbecue" who kidnaps people for ransom and is actively trying to kidnap Haiti as a nation is and has never not been a shit hole. And maybe it's like you say. We should definitely not go in there and fix it and make it all better again. Let's just let barbecue take control of the country and see what happens. Let's see what barbecue does next.
That narrative is from a while ago - in this thread they seem to still be stuck on “Biden is bad, genocide, union buster, as a good leftist person I can’t support him and you shouldn’t either,” even in this article that has nothing to do with that. Also there’s someone who’s saying January 6th wasn’t real.
Someone needs to update their configuration a little, I think.
Yeah, I think some of these people are right wingers posing as leftists just being agent provocateurs. Some are probably actually leftists that are spending a lot of time huffing each others' farts and really do believe that they just need to "send a message" to Democrats by letting donnie snake his way into office. This is the same old tired "the people need to be jolted awake" narrative that has been popular among a certain type of personality ever since I can remember. Maybe these people were always among us. I've noticed they are usually people that are extremely rich (and have options to leave the country) and/or are one of the in-group (white xtian cishet) , or hope to be considered one of the "good ones" if they don't tick all the boxes of the in-group...if their little pipe dream of a magical vanguard of enlightened hoi polloi don't bring about their vision of utopia after the actions of a fascist regime has brought about their awakening...
What they don't seem to realize is that if fascism really comes this time, and when donnie's goons are at their door, telling the goons that these purity ponies didn't vote for Biden will mean sweet fuckall. Also, if they don't get out in time, their money/status and so on won't save them, either.
I think the weird arguments are coming from almost all fake accounts. A couple of them behave like people who genuinely believe the things they're saying, but actually the vast majority of them do not. In my opinion.
I'll never claim to be 100% accurate at telling who is and isn't a faker (and I'm not sure the effort is even a worthwhile thing to spend much energy on), but just consider from this thread the difference of people who are saying things like:
It's cute when the US accuses countries of interfering with elections like they're protecting their world record or something
the hypocrisy is astounding. The USA has been interfering in elections for the year dot.
And people who are saying things like:
After this dude has been caught in like half a dozen lies on behalf of Israel in the last few months, who believes anything he has to say about anything?
They are priming the response when Biden loses, so they can blame someone else for their ineptitude and failure to govern.
To me, it sounds like one grouping read the article / headline, had thoughts occur to them based on the article they read, and typed out those thoughts. It sounds like the other grouping has a little bulleted list in front of them "things we'd like to bring up about the Biden administration" and made a halfhearted attempt at "smooth"ly interjecting them into this topic.
I've seen them slip and interject a talking point that's a total incongruity for the target audience / forum (as one of them did down below with January 6th being a peaceful protest), and I've seen them apparently fail to register that the talking point they're bringing up relates in some way to the topic of the article -- just sort of blandly repeat it with that same "we all agree" fellow kids type of energy instead of grasping the obvious relationship between what they're saying and what's in the article or whatever.
All very good points. Just today on their latest podcast, I heard driftglass/bluegal commenting on the SCOTUS we have and how the cult members on there seemingly want a POTUS with no accountability (basically a king), while reflecting on all the leftist dipshittery over Hillary about how there is no real difference between the Democrats and the Republicans.
Some of the leftists clearly believe this ridiculous and absurd claim (Sadly, I personally know a few of them and they really do hold this dumbass belief, even after Nader and after Stein), but then there are certainly a lot of trolls/bots that are taking that up to try to give the impression that this stupid belief is a common one among progressives/leftists.
I think the point is that the US wanders the world (apart from China), election-meddling and influencing and coup-ing, and then all of a sudden when it happens to us it's some kind of pearl clutching emergency and crime.
To be clear, I don't think we should be doing it to other countries, and I don't think they should be doing it to us. And I think the prospect of another Trump presidency would be so catastrophic for people the world over that it's worth resisting election interference on his behalf, even if you have no particular love for the US and its little adventures on the global stage. But certainly the US State Department getting upset that someone's influencing our democracy, even though we don't want them to, can be met with a certain amount of pure derisive laughter.
They f****** over Pakistan's elections just a few months ago, USA is the king of ruining functioning governments anywhere in the world.
CIA straight up admitted they failed to gain an operational foothold in China like they did everywhere else which is why they never have a solid grasp on what China's next move will be. Not to mention the CCP makes arrests like monthly on people they believe or accuse of having connections to the CIA.
Yeah, every nation does. I don't see your point. Is it not bad? Your comment seems to try to direct anger away from China, but also seems to imply it's bad the US does it. It's bad though, right? You aren't just making this comment to misdirect, right?
While true. Honestly sometimes people don't have the time or energy to do that. We should as much as possible though. It's a good way to touch grass at times. Lest we get too spaced ourselves.
Not gonna lie. First post I saw above of his I almost up voted. But I read further thankfully, and the looked at their profile. Definite untreated mental illness going on there. Sure would be nice to have comprehensive single payer healthcare. :/
Jan 6 is a dog and pony show for liberals to keep them rallied up. Absolutely nothing will come of it other than charging the low hanging fruit. It's the liberal version of 'lock her up,' red meat for the rabid dogs.
You're equating apples and oranges, and the fact that there was an attempt to overthrow the government is a nothingburger to you. it just makes it clear not to take you seriously. You're a joke like your opinions and your sad pathetic existence.
A bunch of guys waving flags is hardly a coup. A coup is an attempt to seize power, running the halls of congress is hardly trying to seize power. It was nothing but a group of people that perceived it as a redress of grievances.
Some of us have things to do other than wait in continuing conversations with strangers online.
I think you probably wanna restrict the “J6 was a peaceful protest” stuff to some of your other accounts that hold some other ostensible viewpoints (probably fully off Lemmy, instead in some place where people get their news more in short-form-video-with-text-over-it format). It will absolutely not get traction here and it will absolutely cause people to look at your account and its motivations in a WHOLE different light.
If you hadn't noticed I don't give a fuck what others think. I'm speaking to the crowd that sees Russians around every corner. And everyone else is responsible for regressive policy other than the DNC
When presented with facts, you bitched up so stfu about trying to speak to anyone. You're not here for discourse, you're here to stir up bs, and I'm going to hold that over you every time we cross paths.
Wow, I guess attempting to overturn the presidential election and the will of the people doesn't constitute as an attempt to overthrow the government. The fact they made plans and conspired to do all of this doesn't ring any alarms to you? As I said before, you're a joke.
Oh, and bringing gallows to this so-called "addressing of grievances" to hang the vice president is totally normal, too, right?
And there it is, ladies and gentlemen. I'm glad you just outright outed yourself rather than continuing your poor attempt at a facade. You're a fucking joke.
I have a new one for the bulleted list that usually just goes over reductions in CO2 emissions, growth in wages for working people even outpacing historic inflation that wasn’t Biden’s doing, etc etc the normal stuff that represents a big upward departure from the norm for US presidents.
Yes, and quite a bit more of them than US presidents usually send. And in my mind, the little fragments of resistance he’s been giving to Netanyahu’s genocidal plan don’t even come close to excusing that.
How much climate damage is US weapons contributing to in the ME? Can't claim wages are up when homelessness is growing and 50% of renters can't afford rent. The elderly are being priced out of their homes and into the streets. Union support is growing because of labor support, not the government. And union support is growing because of stagnant wages.
Just gonna pretend I didn’t send you some links you could read about Biden’s NLRB, and keep repeating the “I’m so left that I can’t support Biden” false narrative piece by piece as if it was true, I guess?
If you believe the bullshit about mitigating climate change and wages from the DNC I'm gonna assume everything else you believe is also bullshit confirmation bias. Leftists would no more support Biden than you would trump.
You invented a whole new type of logical fallacy 😃
“You’re wrong, therefore that thing you said must be wrong, so I don’t have to respond or even read it, because I know it’s wrong because you were the one that said it”
It’s genius. Get the patent; if it takes off you could make a mint.
Yeah no shit. Every major power is trying to influence their rivals' elections, it's the most cost effective way to try and destabilize a country like the U.S. or China. What's more interesting is which side they're interfering for. We know the Republicans are firmly in Moscow's pocket, we know that Trump considers China an enemy, but that doesn't necessarily mean China wants a Democrat either. It could be that the geopolitical gains China made during Trump's administration outweighed all the trade war tariff nonsense, and they want the idiot to drag us further backwards so they can expand their hegemony.
This article basically just repeats my speculation in significantly more detail. Sure Trump said the words "I love China," but the man is a pathological liar who started a trade war with China after saying that and plans to start another one if elected. In his own special way, he even recognizes that the Chinese hegemony is slowly replacing the American one with his rambling on the yuan. They're certainly not friends, and the article's conclusion just indicates that the author thinks Beijing wants a useful idiot.
Trump’s anti-China stance is largely performative, and mostly self-defeating; think domestic tariffs etc.
Sure, that may hurt China’s export potential to the US - but it’s a price the CCP is gambling would pay off in the long-term as Trump’s isolationist stance would weaken regional allies spheres of influence, and provide China the ability to step in and fill the vacuum (best case) or further invade territories they deem theirs (Taiwan, islands within the 9 dashes - worst case).
In situations like this, it’s very much better to side with the devil you know.
China's funneled almost as much money into Donnie's pockets as Russia.
He's also not keen on maintaining alliances with Japan and South Korea. It's an easy choice for them.
After this dude has been caught in like half a dozen lies on behalf of Israel in the last few months, who believes anything he has to say about anything?
I don't doubt it there are influence attempts on the US election by China.
an aside
Still, the selective blindness of the "US" on the Gaza issue has me disappointed in what the Pentagon and Blinken's Department of State overall can and can't see.
I'm sure the same government that uncritically swallows every lie Israel has pushed to further their genocide is exactly who we should trust to vet this intel
