504DR

504DR , 15 days ago

@dnavinci @bhasic @bigheadtales @mintyfresh @lednaBM

Family farms are a world away from the gigantic feedlots and CAFOs we have now.

At least on family farms, the animals were housed and treated much better.
Individuals treated their animals better than Corp. boardrooms and CEOs do.

That said, the planet would be much better off if we all switched to a plant based diet.
Technology now allows us to make faux meat from brewed microbes and plants, as well.

For the sake of the planet, we should be embracing that.

504DR , 15 days ago

@Goldfigure @dnavinci @bhasic @bigheadtales @mintyfresh @lednaBM

Important for humans, not the planet.

The population of domestic livestock is as overpopulated as humans are.

The overpopulation of any species wrecks havoc on a planet meant to support a limited number of each species, so that all flora and fauna can survive and thrive.

Thinking that what only humans want is what got us into this climate crisis mess.

If we want to address climate crisis effectively, we need to consider what is important to the health of the planet, instead of just humans.

This chart shows percentages.
This is unsustainable for a healthy planet that is meant to support all life.

504DR , 15 days ago

@starlily @Goldfigure @dnavinci @bhasic @bigheadtales @mintyfresh @lednaBM

No, it's not.

What leads to overconsumption?
Overpopulation.
What is the result of overconsumption?
Ecological overshoot.

Does anyone believe we would be wrecking as much havoc on the planet as we do with, say 2 billion ppl on the planet?

This article explains ecological overshoot better than I can.

https://medium.com/@elisabethrobson/why-are-we-not-talking-about-ecological-overshoot-f174a53756a5

Linking the overpopulation issue to eugenics is a propaganda tactic used by corps, monied interests and those who want more consumers to buy their products.

Don't fall for it.

504DR , 15 days ago

@BenAveling @lednaBM @nonehitwonder @starlily @Goldfigure @dnavinci @bhasic @bigheadtales @mintyfresh

Numbers do matter.

Looking at one issue of overpopulation can illustrate this, the issue of human sewage. (This would also apply to the overpopulation of any species.)

The planet evolved into systems that recycle the waste from each/all species; recycling it and using it to regenerate the soil, providing a continuation of food sources.

Human waste is not the ideal fertilizer, lacking in the amounts of necessary nutrients, bc of our heavily laden meat diets.
This is one reason meat isn't added to home compost systems.

For every living thing that excretes waste, there are natural systems that evolved to recycle waste back into the environment in a time consuming manner.

Humans invented methods of recycling our waste, which mostly worked for a time.

But now, with 8 billion ppl pooping and peeing huge quantities every minute of every day, even our invented systems are overwhelmed, and raw sewage is regularly being released into the environment by cities and towns across the globe.

This is unsanitary, carrying it's own health threats, as well as leading to an unhealthy environment all around.

These threats would be far lesser, and more easily managed with fewer humans on the planet.

Numbers do make a difference.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/half-of-the-worlds-coastal-sewage-pollution-flows-from-few-dozen-places/

https://www.sej.org/headlines/epa-letting-cities-dump-more-raw-sewage-rivers-years-come

https://www.nhm.ac.uk/discover/news/2021/november/the-deadly-effects-of-sewage-pollution-on-nature.html

504DR , 14 days ago

@dnavinci @BenAveling @lednaBM @nonehitwonder @starlily @Goldfigure @bhasic @bigheadtales @mintyfresh

1. I didn't say they were scientific papers; I said they were based on scientific assessments and data.
   Is it your opinion that the sources I listed are fly-by-night orgs, who rely on non credible, untested data?

2. I'd have to say you don't understand ecological overshoot when you agree there is ecological overshoot but don't see the direct connection between population numbers and ecological overshoot.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ecological_overshoot

You are looking at this from a human only perspective; ignoring the effects that 8+ billion ppl have on the natural world.

The number of ppl in any area has direct effects on the natural environment of that area.
Loss of habitat that other life forms rely on to survive is the main one.
Increased pollution from humans and their activities is another.

We are now experiencing the 6th mass extinction of flora and fauna on the planet.
Directly caused by humans.
I would argue that this wouldn't be happening if there weren't 8+ billion ppl sucking away all of the regenerative resources meant to support all life on the planet.

There was 2.8 billion ppl when I was born.
There were problems of loss of the natural world even back then, but they could have been managed and mitigated.
With 8+ billion ppl, that is impossible now; cities encompass 40 or more miles, even the small towns of the past have suburbs to them. All of that means more natural lands lost to the food systems to feed us and the businesses that support our lifestyles.
Watching the natural world be destroyed and disappearing in real time has been heartbreaking, knowing what the consequences will be.

Ecological overshoot is true in even poor countries and areas.

"The major threats to Ngorongoro Conservation Area relates to the increase in the resident's population alongside their livestock and the socio-cultural changes. Tourism is growing rapidly, creating intense pressure for supporting infrastructure e.g. accommodation and roads. Some of these threats to the property’s Outstanding Universal Values are partially being addressed and its overall ecological integrity is still maintained. However, the movement corridors in and out of the Crater itself are being disintegrated because of growth in human population, particularly from the Crater itself towards Serengeti, to and past Olbalbal and along the Olduvai Gorge, as well as the Ndutu to the Crater corridor via the highlands. Closer engagement with local communities in exploring alternative livelihood solutions are needed. Threats from fire, disease transmission from domestic stock and human-wildlife conflicts are under control. Spread of highly invasive alien species (IAS) remains a major threat due to its high occurrence outside the NCA boundary. High levels of awareness and readiness for rapid response are vitally important to protect the rangelands of the NCA and Serengeti against the impacts of this high impact IAS."

https://worldheritageoutlook.iucn.org/explore-sites/wdpaid/2010

(When the NCA was created, land was set aside for the 10k Maasai ppl who lived there. Today there are 100k Maasai living in the same area - leading to the problems listed in the article.)

The planet evolved to support a varied and large diversity of life, all intertwined with each other to keep this planet thriving with life.
Eliminating (extinction) of any one part effects the survival of all life.

We are pushing countless species of life forms into extinction on a frighteningly regular basis now.

This wouldn't be happening if 8+ billion ppl weren't taking every resource available and leaving nothing for the rest of life on the planet to survive on.

504DR , 1 month ago

@breadandcircuses

Just want you to know how much I appreciate your continuing work to educate us on the true state of our circumstances, and the possible, effective ways of dealing with it all - in an honest and clear way.

Our views, and that of this author, line up almost perfectly, but my deliveries of the same message are too blunt and harsh for most ppl.
I can't help that, and don't apologize for it.
Communication isn't my strong suit.
Some get it, others get too butt hurt by it to hear the message.

I am grateful for and appreciate beyond words you and the others who carry this very heavy burden so well.
🙏🫂🙏

504DR , 1 month ago

@susankayequinn @breadandcircuses

As a doomer, I certainly don't want to see the present and coming devastation that climate change effects are having now, and by the majority of climate scientists, will continue to get worse and more frequent.

None of the doomers I know want that either.
We are collectively both heartbroken and angry about it.

Heartbroken bc every day the damage continues; deforestation, mining, drilling, and the loss of more and more wild places. Every minute of every day the damages go on.
All of these activities is what caused this climate crisis. Continuing on with them unabated adds to the crisis.

Angry bc of this continuation, but also bc there are effective, workable measures that at the least, wouldn't add to the problem, and at best, be a part of real solutions.
But time, money and resources are instead wasted on unproven tech with pie in the sky promises and/or measures that do not do enough good to be worthwhile.

Believe me, we don't want it to be this way.

We're just not shying away from the truth of the planet's and our situation.
If our situation is going to get harder/rougher, I want to know that. I want to be prepared as best as I can; the same way ppl want to be warned of tornadoes or hurricanes, so they can be prepared.

Did you read the whole article?
You think the studies they did, showing that doom and gloom can be a motivator for many ppl, were all flawed or wrong?
That over optimism can have a complacency effect on ppl?

Some ppl seek as much information as possible, then act on it.
Others let other ppl reassure them that all is well, don't worry, we'll take care of it for you.

Doomers are in the first group.

Knowing as much information as I do on this climate crisis, I certainly have little faith in those that created it coming up with the solutions to address it.

No world leaders have called for slashing our energy use - which should be our first course of action.
Drilling, mining, deforestation, habitat destruction, polluting lands, air and waters; all continue on.

And the damages and devastation continue on, every minute of every day.

504DR , 1 month ago

@susankayequinn @joriki @breadandcircuses

You say anger like it's a bad thing.

504DR , 1 month ago

@susankayequinn @joriki @breadandcircuses

Yup, we do both want the same thing.

The difference is you think it will come to happen and I think odds of it happening are slim to none.

If we had the luxury of time, there might've been a chance.

But realistically - the old system of step 1, step 2, step 3. . .isn't going to cut it timewise . That's partly what got us here.

Climate change effects have shocked climate scientists with how they are happening decades sooner than expected, with the frequency and intensity increasing as well.

Scientists who deal with the natural world are terrified. They have the data.
Estimates range from 2040s to 2070s for total ecological collapse.
Billions of solar panels and turbines won't save us from that (the making of them, with fossil fuels, is adding to the climate crisis, which is about much more than just C02).

We should be planning, building and preparing for what's ahead as best we can, rather than continue on as usual; logging, mining, drilling and polluting, bc politicians make 🤑 off the corps who make more 🤑.

Remember when emissions went down drastically?
During the covid lockdown.
That's the life we should be planning for; modified with lessons learned from the first one.

The best solutions will have an immediate effect.
Getting to the least energy usage possible. Cutting out the waste alone could be easily done. Our planet doesn't need to be lit up in space like a giant times square.
I remember a time when it wasn't.

Ppl don't want to give up their modern luxuries.
Future generations won't have that opportunity.
The least we could do is cut back on ours now so they may have some of something.

In the meantime, by all means, work towards whatever solutions/causes/beliefs you choose, with whatever attitude you choose.
Ofc we are all different.

But whatever solutions your working for, they shouldn't do more harm than good.

You want to talk solutions?
Here's some actions that would have immediate and impactful effects
:
Eliminate meat production and adopt a meat alternative and plant based diet.
Cease air travel except the most needed.
Ration gas and energy use.
End global trade of non essential goods.
Cut consumerism to essential items only.
Ban tourism.
Ban mining, drilling and deforestation.
Eliminate non essential jobs.

All of these, plus others, would cut emissions drastically, as well as be good for the health of the planet, which is the ultimate goal. No healthy planet, no healthy life on that planet.

Future generations deserve that sacrifice from us, imo.

Back to chances; the odds of our money hungry, spoiled society, led by idiots, doing any of those things, in a thousand years, much less the short window we have now, don't look good.

So, wish for something better, but be prepared for the worst is where I'm at.

504DR , 1 month ago

@TheVulgarTongue @histodons

It isn't human entertainment if animals aren't terrorized, tortured and killed.
🙄

504DR , 2 months ago

@breadandcircuses

From the article:

"The somber truth is that the vast bulk of nature’s staggering abundance has already disappeared. We live in a world characterized primarily by the relative silence and emptiness of its natural spaces. It’s only when we read accounts of wildlife from centuries ago that we realize how much is gone. One eighteenth-century writer, standing on the shores of Wales, described schools of herrings five or six miles long, so dense that “the whole water seems alive; and it is seen so black with them to a great distance, that the number seems inexhaustible.” In the seventeenth-century Caribbean, sailors could navigate at night by the noise of massive shoals of sea turtles heading to nesting beaches on the Cayman Islands. In the Chesapeake Bay, plagued today by polluted dead zones, hunters harvested a hundred thousand terrapins a year for turtle soup. In the nineteenth century, passenger pigeons would blot out the sun when they appeared in massive flocks throughout the eastern United States. The last one died in a zoo in 1914.

The Great Dying
In normal times, extinction is a natural part of evolution: new species evolve from prior existing species, meaning that, rather than dying out, “extinct” species are really the progenitors of new ones. When extinctions occur, however, as part of a mass extinction, they represent a grave and permanent loss to the richness of life. Species exterminated by human development are wiped out from nature’s palette, terminating any possibility of further evolutionary branching. The average lifespan of a species is roughly a million years—the unfolding story of each one is, in E. O. Wilson’s words, a unique epic. We’ve seen how life’s prodigious diversity on Earth can be understood as nature’s own evolved intelligence, earned over billions of years. Through extinction, we are dumbing down nature, eliminating the plenitude it has so painstakingly accumulated."

504DR , 2 months ago

@breadandcircuses

Enjoy!
Safe travels.

504DR , 2 months ago

@CelloMomOnCars @DeliaChristina

I came across this vid of one woman's journey leading her to 4B.
I think it's a good explanation of the reasoning behind the movement and why it will grow.

Note to men watching this - if the behavior exampled doesn't describe you, it isn't directed at you.

#patriarchy
#PersonalGrowth
#4Bmovement

Video of one woman's journey to the 4B movement.

504DR , 2 months ago

@breadandcircuses

From the article:

Unfortunately, the planned switch to low-carbon energy sources and the electrification of heating and transport technologies will not decrease our dependency on the steel industry – on the contrary. A low-carbon power grid requires much more steel (and other materials) than an infrastructure based on fossil fuels. Wind and solar power are very diffuse power sources compared to fossil fuels. Therefore, it takes much more materials (and land) to produce the same energy. In jargon, wind and solar have low “power density” or high “material intensity.”2829303132

A low-carbon power grid requires much more steel than an infrastructure based on fossil fuels.

The “steel intensity” of thermal gas and coal power plants is between 50 and 60 tonnes of steel per megawatt of installed power.33 Hydroelectric power plants have a lower steel intensity, with 20-30 tonnes of steel per MW.733 Atomic power’s steel intensity is also lower at between 20 and 40 tonnes of steel per installed MW.3334 On the other hand, solar PV requires between 40 and 170 tonnes of steel per installed MW.3335 Although there is little or no steel in the solar panels themselves, it’s the material of choice for the structures that support them.

Steel and wind power
The most steel-intensive power source – by far – is the modern wind turbine. The steel intensity of a wind turbine depends on its size. A single, large wind turbine requires significantly more steel per megawatt of installed power than two smaller wind turbines.36 For example, a 3.6 MW wind turbine with a 100-meter tall tower requires 335 tons of steel (83 tons/MW), while a 5 MW wind turbine with a 150-meter tall tower needs 875 tons of steel (175 tons/MW).37 The trend is towards taller wind turbines and a higher steel intensity.

Steel consumption further increases for offshore wind turbines. Onshore wind power plants rely on reinforced concrete for their foundations, but offshore wind turbines need massive steel structures such as monopiles and jackets.38 The steel intensity for offshore wind turbines is calculated to be around 450 tonnes per MW for a 5 MW turbine – eight times higher than the steel intensity of a thermal power plant.36. As these wind turbines get taller and move into deeper waters, their steel use further increases.

The most popular offshore wind turbine nowadays has a capacity of 7 MW, while the largest ones have a capacity of 14 MW.36 If we make a conservative estimate based on the data above (the steel intensity doubles for every doubling of the power capacity), a 14 MW offshore wind turbine would require 1,300 tons of steel per MW or 18,200 tonnes in total. Such a wind turbine thus consumes 24 times more steel than a coal or gas power plant of the same power capacity.

Power transmission infrastructure
The data above only include the steel used in the power plants themselves. For fossil fuel power plants, they do not include the steel used in the pipelines, oil rigs, coal excavators, and the like. However, the same goes for the low-carbon power sources. Because they need much more resources than thermal power plants (steel but also other metals and materials), they depend on a global mining and transport infrastructure that is just as steel-intensive as the supply chain for fossil fuels.

Furthermore, because they are more diffuse power sources with intermittent and unpredictable power production, often located far away from energy consumption centers, renewable power plants drive the expansion of transmission infrastructure. That infrastructure is also based on steel – from switchyard equipment over towers to conduction cables.282930313242

Finally, low-carbon power sources also have a high need for special grades of steel, which are more energy-intensive to produce. Steel for off-shore wind turbines should resist corrosion, and stainless steel is increasingly used for solar panel support structures.43 Electrical lamination steel (iron-silicon) is indispensable for transformers in the power network.7 Nuclear power plants may have a relatively low steel intensity but are completely built up of energy-intensive specialty steels. For example, cladding the fuel elements containing fissionable uranium requires zirconium steel, while all structural elements contain austenitic stainless steel.

504DR , 2 months ago

@breadandcircuses

The article's conclusion - sounds like degrowth to me.

"The low-tech solutions

The picture painted above seems to offer little hope for carbon-neutral steelmaking and power production. However, there is a low-tech solution that could achieve it. We could adjust steel production to the available scrap supply both in quantity and quality. That would allow us to produce all steel from scrap in electric arc furnaces, dramatically reducing energy consumption and eliminating almost all carbon emissions. Of course, the intent should not be to replace steel with plastic composites and aluminum because they are even more energy-intensive to produce. The only solution is to reduce material use overall.

We could adjust steel production to the available scrap supply both in quantity and quality.

Reducing the steel output and using more common steel grades would not bring us back to the Bronze Age. As noted, global end-of-life ferrous scrap availability was approximately 450 Mt in 2021, which would allow us to produce roughly one-quarter of the current steel output. Furthermore, the scrap supply will continue to rise for the next 40 years, enabling us to produce more and more low-emission steel each year. By 2050, scrap availability is expected to rise to about 900 Mt, almost half of today’s global steel production.48 All that extra steel could be invested in expanding the low-carbon power grid without raising emissions first.

There is a lot of room to reduce the steel intensity of modern society. All our basic needs – and more – could be supplied with much less steel involved. For example, we could make cars lighter by making them smaller. That would bring energy savings without the need for energy-intensive high-grade steel. We could replace cars with bicycles and public transportation so that more people share less steel. Such changes would also reduce the need for steel in the road network, the energy infrastructure, and the manufacturing industry. We would need fewer machine tools, shipping containers, and reinforced concrete buildings. Whenever steel intensity is reduced, the advantages cascade throughout the whole system. Preventing corrosion and producing steel more locally from local resources would also reduce energy use and emissions.1014

The continuous growth of the steel output – the increasing steel intensity of human society – makes sustainable steel production impossible. No technology can change that because it’s not a technological problem. Like forestry can only be sustainable if the wood demand does not exceed the wood supply, steel is sustainable or not depending on the balance between (scrap) supply and (steel) demand. We may not be able to escape the Iron Age, but we have an option to escape the catch-22 that inextricably links steel production with fossil fuels."

504DR , 2 months ago

@breadandcircuses @ariadne @CelloMomOnCars @chris @crash_course

Many thanks, B&C.
I've recently been scolded and some of my posts removed, so I'm laying low for a bit.
Reposting yours and other great accounts, tho. 👍

504DR , 3 months ago

@breadandcircuses @gdeihl

When some future aliens land on our dry and dead planet and they go rummaging around and come across this essay, one of them will look to the others and say;

"They should have listened to this guy".

504DR , 3 months ago

@gdeihl @breadandcircuses

You're welcome, Geoffrey.
I sincerely meant that.

I appreciate your work, and sharing it with us.
Much needed words in these times.

504DR , 3 months ago (edited 3 months ago)

@breadandcircuses

The only tried and true method of drastically and immediately reducing ghgs (without causing further environmental damage) is to have a lockdown similar to the covid lockdown of 2020, but modified, better implemented and for a longer period of time.

Worried about the inconvenience?
Not half as worried as your children and grandchildren will be 10 to 20 years.

Worried about the economy?
Our current economic systems worldwide are based on and thrive on the exploitive actions that causes ghgs emissions.

We have the luxury now of making these changes in the best ways possible.

Your children and grandchildren won't have that if we do nothing; it will be forced on them by the mounting climate changes happening now and accelerating faster every year.

504DR , 3 months ago

@rabia_elizabeth @palestine @israel

Why are Palestinians doing this!?!

👇
Oh, maybe that's why.

504DR , 3 months ago

@RememberUsAlways @palestine @israel

Great link, thank you for adding this.

Going thru the whole list, it's telling how much listed under "violence" are actions committed against Palestinians, especially the number of assassinations of Palestinian leader and activists.
Those are not acts by a good faith player in this game.

The US has been complicit in this violence committed by Israel every step of the way, too. Shameful.

While I'm not qualified to offer a solution to this mess, I can easily side with and support those being brutalized, oppressed and slaughtered.

504DR , 3 months ago

@RememberUsAlways @palestine @israel

Any cornered animal will fight, with whatever means they have at their disposal.

Israel has shown to not have been a good faithed player in this game, ever, since it's inception.

Israel brought this on to themselves, and their actions over the years only cemented the hostilities between the two.

This latest overblown response against innocent Palestinian civilians lays bare their ultimate goal - the removal of every Palestinian and stealing the land from them.
You've heard of the current sales of land in Gaza run by Jewish players over there right now, right?
Non Jews aren't allowed to participate in these sales. What message do you clean from that fact?

Whatever has happened in the past, the current slaughter of tens of thousands of Palestinians, and the forced starvation of those remaining alive is indefensible.

Israel has been fvcking around for decades now.
I for one, look forward to their finding out phase.

504DR , 3 months ago

@tzafrir @rabia_elizabeth @palestine @israel

https://www.palquest.org/en/overallchronology?show=intro

Read this and get back to me.

Be sure to read the sections under Violence, and the number of Palestinian leaders and activists assassinated by Israel.

If you come back in less than 5 minutes, I'll know you didn't read any of it.

In the age of information, ignorance is a choice.

Here's your opportunity to make the right choice.

504DR , 3 months ago

@RememberUsAlways @tzafrir @palestine @israel

Credit where credit is due.

I appreciate you posted this link.
A deep dive into the history of the area and the resulting conflict.

I'm unable to stay neutral on the topic, myself.
Especially in light of Israeli leadership's current, ongoing actions.

I do wish for peace in the region, but the dogs of war are now loose on both sides, and my sympathies lie with the innocent civilians (on both sides) caught in the middle.

At the least, the US should stop supporting Israel, sending them money and weapons and demand an immediate, lasting ceasefire.

504DR , 3 months ago

@FantasticalEconomics

A quick study of the history of Palestine and then the creation of Israel and what had happened since then easily shows me which side I'm on in that conflict, and have been for 20 years now.

The settlements are especially disgusting.

What Israel has done over those years since inception has been wrong at every turn; blatant apartheid for decades has now turned to outright genocide.

With their govts approval, Israeli players are now selling land in Gaza. They plan to build condos on the bombed lands where bodies are still buried in the rubble.

Who does that?!?

Not good, ppl, that's for sure.

504DR , 3 months ago

@FantasticalEconomics

This picture speaks volumes to me.

As well as the decades of apartheid Palestinians have been living with.

Israel routinely arrests, tortures and kills children, for throwing rocks.

Israel supports Israeli settlers attacking Palestinians and stealing their homes and lands.

Israel controls every aspect of Palestinians lives nowadays, denying food, water and supplies, not only now but for decades.
The number of Israeli ppl killed or harmed by Palestinians is dwarfed by the number of Palestinians killed or harmed by Israel.

At some point, the numbers have to make a difference. And that number of deaths of Palestinians has now grown by tens of thousands due to the current genocide.

Hamas is only a result of all these years of oppression by Israel.

504DR , 3 months ago

@breadandcircuses

I fear all kinds of geo and eco engineering are already underway, just kept under wraps for now bc they don't know what the exact outcome will be. 😬

As always, the unintended (deadly) consequences will come to light sooner rather than later, with no recourse or fix available.

m.i.s.o.t.p.m.a.

504DR , 3 months ago

@breadandcircuses

I'm no scientist, and it gives me no pleasure, but every prediction I've made since the 70s on the state of the planet has come true, and none of it has been good.

Fwiw, I predict these times now are the best it will be from here on out, and it's all downhill from here.

Plan accordingly.

504DR , 3 months ago

@philip_cardella

I used to be a big believer/promoter of "well regulated" capitalism, which intended to round out the worst edges of capitalism.

But seeing the state of the world, and the naivety/complacency of the general public, I've realized that well regulated capitalism is a pipedream.

Ppl falling for the dumbest of reasonings, by the least intelligent of us, show that there will be no regulations on capitalism.
Even FDR's version lacked in many areas; not addressing racism, speciesism or the environment.
Given enough time, those issues may have been solved, but for the group of ppl who made it their life's quest to undo everything he'd done. And they have won that battle in spades, with most of his programs eliminated or watered down so badly as to be mere reflections of what they once were/intended to be.

Capitalism is completely about making money for corps and shareholders, and that requires destruction of the natural world to do that.

I can't see where any form of capitalism will benefit us and/or the planet.

504DR , 3 months ago

@philip_cardella

There are always alternatives; socialism comes closest for me to a better way of life for all.

But we aren't trapped into picking an already defined/tried social system.

We could easily choose a completely new system based on the best ideas of all those already defined/tried, imo.

504DR , 3 months ago

@philip_cardella

You're right to be terrified of fascism, as am I. Anyone who isn't is either not paying attention or been bamboozled into thinking it will benefit them while vanquishing their perceived enemies.

My main criticism of capitalism is that it relies on exploitation for it's success; exploitation of the planet and ppl.

We've taken so much from the planet already there won't be much left for future generations (if there are any future generations bc of climate change, of which capitalism played a huge part, imo).
We are now in the find out phase of ecological overshoot and no tech or imaginary being will be able to stop that.

Capitalism also exploits ppl terribly, always chasing after the cheapest labor, segregating ppl by income and encouraging the worst business practices of brutality towards some so others can hoard money.

The US has been capitalist since it's inception. FDR did try to tame the worst of capitalism's ideals; but looking where we're at right now, it wasn't successful in the long term.

So here we are now, with a shrunken middle class, and millions of Americans one paycheck away from becoming jobless and/or homeless. Despite the economic headlines, wages are still stagnant, not even keeping up with inflation.

There has to be a better way than this.

Bc you are correct in saying dire economic conditions are an incubator for fascism to grow and thrive.

504DR , 3 months ago

@breadandcircuses

Is this a good time to point out that dinosaurs survived 40 million years longer than "the most intelligent creature on the planet" has?

It's not the size of the brain that matters as much as what you do with that brain.

504DR OP , 4 months ago

@BeAware

In order to pin a post, it has to be a post I created (that's the only way I know, anyways).

I can repost his post, but that doesn't pin it to my profile page, where I want to save it and share with as many others as possible.

504DR OP , 4 months ago

@tmstreet @LeftistLawyer

I agree.

A species that actively works towards it's own extinction isn't long for this universe.

It's better to play by nature's rules and live within planetary boundaries.

504DR , 4 months ago

@breadandcircuses

Enjoy yourself to the fullest.

You deserve it. 👍

504DR , 4 months ago

@breadandcircuses

They'll fry right along with the rest of us when we hit 3C.

504DR , 4 months ago

@ljohn44 @gerrymcgovern

Exactly that, plus more.

Does anyone seriously think our aging, decrepit electrical grid can handle it when we "electrify everything!"?

Like, the increased mining for the resources to update and expand the grid won't add to our emissions problem?

504DR , 4 months ago

@breadandcircuses

I wish more ppl would understand this reality, and stop participating in it. 👇

"Mining, the topic I addressed last week, serves as a perfect example here. In order to make a golden ring weighing 5 grams, the mine producing the precious metal has to dig up and haul 5,000,000 grams (or 5 tons!) of ore to the surface. (For reference: imagine a pile of stones the size of a pick-up truck.) Then these rocks must be crushed into a fine dust, and mixed with a similar amount of water and aggressive chemicals to leach out all the 5 grams of gold. So in order to get that little piece of low entropy material on your finger, the industry had to produce and leave behind a tailing the size of a garden pool full of toxic chemicals, finely ground rocks and muddy water… Not to mention the plumes of diesel smoke and CO2 mixed into the atmosphere during the process, or the energy needed to deliver that gold to a smelter, getting it melted and shaped into a ring."

504DR , 4 months ago

@breadandcircuses

"The same goes to mining and enriching Uranium, making solar panels or drilling for oil. All technologies, be them extractive or manufacturing in nature, increase entropy on a scale many orders of magnitude greater than the product they make represent. In fact, as rich resources deplete with time we are forced to tap into ever lower grade ores and reservoirs, leaving ever higher entropy behind for the same amount of products produced."

504DR , 4 months ago

@breadandcircuses @RealJournalism

Classic article of hopium.
All hype and no facts.

Anyone saying an increase of 3C temp will be good for us and the planet doesn't understand physics, biology or climate change.

504DR , 4 months ago

@CelloMomOnCars @fcktheworld587 @migriverat @thesquirrelfish @RiaResists

Recycling plastic is evolving.

Our local recycle center just expanded the type of plastics they accept bc they have a source that makes outdoor furniture from them.

Every little bit helps until we can do away with plastic altogether.

504DR , 4 months ago

@shojiwax

I'm on the older side of life, so I'll probably be gone by the time the worst hits. In the meantime, we have land to grow our food and a good water supply. And we're 100 miles from the big cities.

For younger ppl, my recommendation would be to join or establish small communities of self reliance.
And be prepared to defend them.

No one will survive the coming 3C.

Jordan Perry, speaking Michael Down on collapse, has 14 actions on dealing with it that I find sobering, but honest and helpful.

https://youtu.be/O4Yx-aO36Mg?feature=shared

504DR , 4 months ago (edited 4 months ago)

@breadandcircuses

"Don’t expect that someone somewhere will come up with something either. Collapse once started is irreversible. And newsflash: it’s already well underway… Increasing and maintaining complexity (including devising ever more sophisticated technologies, requiring ever more electricity and mining) would take an exponential increase in energy uptake, hence the term energy cannibalization. Slurping ever more oil from underneath our feet, or building ever more elaborate “renewable” devices on the back of rapidly degrading mineral reserves, will soon take more energy than it can give back to society. This is a process which can only get worse with more technology use. You see, it is technology itself which is unsustainable, not fossil fuel use alone."

https://thehonestsorcerer.medium.com/collapse-will-look-nothing-like-in-the-movies-e753f510492d

504DR , 4 months ago (edited 4 months ago)

@breadandcircuses

"Once net energy peaks and starts to contract, it will mean a permanent economic contraction. Complex systems like corporations, governments or the world economy only “know” how to grow, they really suck when it comes to shrinkage. And while the rank and file of governments and corporations will do everything they can to keep the system together, they will be fighting a losing battle. This is why large complex systems are fragile: instead of voluntarily giving up functions, and simplify to conserve energy, they do the diametric opposite. They concentrate power even more, and allow their rent seeking oligarchs to siphon off any remaining wealth, while the lower ranks fight tooth and nail to keep things together. At least until physics ultimately wins, and things inevitably fall apart."

https://thehonestsorcerer.medium.com/collapse-will-look-nothing-like-in-the-movies-e753f510492d

504DR , 4 months ago

@TobiWanKenobi @breadandcircuses

You give a clear explanation of why they suck at shrinking, so you're both correct.

You're most correct on the prediction that the climate crisis will eventually make capitalism moot, as it will all other forms of economies.

Collapse is inevitable at this point.

Better to prepare for that rather than trying to fight it is the message I get.