Why do posters say that increase in Linux Steam share doesnt count becuase its mostly steam deck users?

It's not the gotcha that they think it is. Increasing share of Linux, steam deck or not is progress. Any development or considerations made for the SteamDeck and its Arch based OS benefit the non SteamDeck Linux gaming scene too.

Mostly a stab at Reddit PCMR, Lemmy PCMR has a different vibe.

hal_5700X ,
@hal_5700X@sh.itjust.works avatar

Am I the only one, who thinks Linux gaming is a Valve/Steam walled garden?

Kolanaki ,
@Kolanaki@yiffit.net avatar

It's more of a white picket fence than a wall.

Caligvla ,
@Caligvla@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

My understanding is that it implies most Deck owners aren't using them for anything other than purely gaming, then switching back to Windows for everything else. I kind of agree with that point, sure there are more Linux machines out there, but people are still using Windows over them, if the Deck was a standard PC and people were ditching their Windows machines for it that'd a different story. That said, it still means more people using Linux at the end of the day even if just occasionally and in a very restricted way, make of that what you will.

ColeSloth ,

People are buying a game system that uses Linux. They aren't choosing Linux, and most of them aren't using it as an operating system of any sort aside from gaming. So yeah. It only half counts.

flop_leash_973 ,

Because they are more concerned with the fact that devs aren’t making the games for Linux natively in most cases than they are with if you can play most games on Linux.

Lojcs ,

I'm more concerned with native Linux ports often being worse than windows in terms of performance and support, succumbing to disrepair years later

kender242 ,
@kender242@lemmy.world avatar

Year of the Linux Desktop may never be a relevant measure, but it was Steam Deck and Proton that marked the transition for me.

The deck is awesome because it's Linux

Potatos_are_not_friends ,

I'd argue it's awesome because it's a great product that lets you play games on the go.

The huge win is that its running on Linux, and valve contributes to open-source with Proton!

TeNppa ,

Bought my child the Steam Deck and that convinced me to switch to Linux. Games were the biggest reason I didn't make the switch earlier and seeing how well they ran on SD helped me realize most of the games I play, will run just fine.

PassingThrough ,

I think it’s because generally speaking, thanks to the efforts of Valve with game mode etc to create the console like experience, many that have a Steam Deck don’t “use” Linux…they use Steam, they click Install and they click Play and that’s it.

folkrav ,

Does it really matter? How many Windows users’ usage just launch a browser and use that, aren’t they effectively not “using” Windows per se?

Kecessa , (edited )

The point is that these people don't care or might not even know it's Linux in the background, the Deck could auto launch Steam in full screen mode from Windows for all they know.

Hell, I'm tech savvy and I honestly don't care that it's Linux based, I would have bought it no matter the OS running in the background, for me it's basically a game console, anything that needs a regular OS I do from my PC.

I would even have preferred to have it run a modified version of Windows because of the 100% compatibility with my library (I'm expecting a portable Xbox to come out at some point and to be exactly that).

folkrav ,

My point was twofold: that the type of user that wouldn’t care about it being Linux or not just wouldn’t care either way, and that making a distinction based on… intent (?) is arbitrary. They’d have perfectly counted as Windows users if the Deck was a Windows machine, after all…

Kecessa ,

Sure and that's why I think they should be in their own category (no matter the OS)

PassingThrough ,

That’s right. Had Steam Deck run Windows, or even for those that install Windows and join the survey, they would be lumped in with the Windows metric and nobody would care as it would be a drop in the ocean.

Linux is the underdog, always has been, maybe always will be. So any uptick in metrics is far more significant than a twitch in the Windows numbers and gets a more exciting response. I think the problem is many don’t see it as true adoption when Steam Deck has such a console-like experience for a lot of users…for the naysayers it is like including PlayStations in the survey and saying FreeBSD users are everywhere. Technically yes, but also no, right?

That doesn’t make a great example because you don’t even have the option to exit PlayStation and use BSD, but I hope it gets the idea across.

owenfromcanada ,
@owenfromcanada@lemmy.world avatar

I've noticed some posters in these communities have that toxic attitude of superiority and exclusivity--they simultaneously want people to use Linux, but also take pride in their "chops" and look down on people who don't know as much. It's along the same lines as those rude or hostile responses to more basic questions. I haven't seen it as much here on Lemmy, fortunately.

fishpen0 ,

It’s a bell curve. Believe me, after spending my entire work day doing Linux shit as a SRE/Devop/cloud engineer over the last 12 years of my career, the absolute last fucking thing I want to do when I stop working is fiddle with one more goddamn Linux issue before launching a game. True elites don’t give a fuck and just want to play the damn game. You can spot a poser the second they take it too seriously and bitch you out for running vanilla mint or whatever

Nibodhika ,

100% this, the more you know about Linux the less you care about the distro. Realistically I use Arch because I'm lazy and the AUR and wiki are fantastic, but the company laptop came with Ubuntu and that's what it will keep on running, I have servers running Debian, I've worked with devices running some flavor of Red hat, it's all the same, and whenever I see someone trying to be elitist for running Arch I imagine a 15YO living in their mom's basement thinking they're cool because they managed to follow simple instructions.

Hello_there ,

'you have to struggle thru a Linux experience like I did or you're not a real Linux user'

neidu2 ,

'I use Arch, btw'

neidu2 ,

I think the argument being made is that it doesn't mean more users are manually migrating to linux, because you don't buy a steamdeck because of its OS. You use steamOS because it comes with the steam deck.

However, users choosing linux over windows is only one aspect of the good news: Widespread linux use, intentional or not, makes it less likely that a developer will skip it as a platform "not worth the extra effort"

Telorand ,

Being a Steam Deck owner myself, it also exposes more people to the underlying OS. I think there's a fundamental misunderstanding that people who use a Steam Deck only ever use it in Game Mode, and that's simply untrue.

I was convinced to buy one, because a user said they bought one for each of their kids as a stand-in for a laptop, and they would do their homework on it (in addition to playing games).

And now, because of my personal exposure, I have Bazzite running full time on a laptop, and I'm testing a few other Linux distros to eventually replace my Win 11 Pro install on my main desktop machine.

Those people should leave the purity tests and gatekeeping to the religious fundies.

neidu2 , (edited )

I've never touched a steam deck nor its OS. How much of the underlying OS is exposed to the user? Is it easy to bring up a terminal emulator?

BasicallyHedgehog ,
@BasicallyHedgehog@feddit.uk avatar

It's surprisingly straightforward! There's a menu option in the UI that can switch you to desktop mode, which is KDE Plasma. You can open up a terminal emulator from the K menu there.

neidu2 ,

Alright, good to know.

Also, the gate is open come in. There seems to be some elitism regarding the choice of distro, but don't pay any attention to that. "Mint and Ubuntu are noob distros, I use arch btw" is only partially a meme.

I'm a linux user of 20+ years, and I run Mint on my desktop. Arch users are the linux equivalent of the car guys who spend ages tuning engine performance and gear ratios in their car. I just want something that works well and that does what I need it to do in a reliable way. Plus, the Mint user base is so large that it's relatively easy to find a workaround/fix for whatever strategy nge issue you might run into.

I hear good things about Pop OS, but I have no firat hand experience with it, so I can't comment on that.

ricdeh ,
@ricdeh@lemmy.world avatar

Ubuntu is not controversial because it is a "noob distro", it is controversial because the company behind it (Canonical) is turning almost as bad as Micro$oft.

neidu2 ,

While maybe not quite the hyperbole of turning into MS, it's not entirely wrong either. That's why LMDE was created - in case they go completely off the rails. And that's why I run LMDE - I support the move.

Leminski OP ,
@Leminski@lemmy.world avatar

Use Pop!_OS myself. Its "grand" / "fine".

I'd recommend it to a new user. If however you are an existing user who's happy I'd say not to bother.

Pop!_OS and Fedora are my usual choices for a desktop OS, unless I have reasons not to.

Nibodhika ,

One thing to note though is that SteamOS is immutable, i.e. / is blocked for writes by default, you can only write to /home, so you need to install things via flatpaks not via package manager. So not ideal for a power user, but should be enough for most people.

I disagree that Arch guys are the guy who tunes up everything, I think that would be Gentoo. I think Arch guys are the equivalent of the guy that built his own PC, it's not an impressive feat (even though some act as if they were superiors for doing it) and probably lots of the people who buy prebuilts can do it, they chose not to bother assembling things if they can get someone to do it for them. The reason I think this is because I use Arch for the same reason I built my PC, i.e. I'm lazy and want something that might be a slight hoccup to setup but will be a breeze to maintain, it might be a Frankenstein, but it's the Frankenstein I built and know.

Kecessa ,

"that's simply untrue"

Until proven with actual usage stats I continue to believe it's an extremely small minority that uses the Linux part.

Telorand ,

Okay. I never made the assertion that it was a majority. But asserting that it's an "extremely small" minority is a positive claim you should back up with evidence, or else you're just appealing to your own confirmation bias.

Kecessa ,

You made the original claim so the onus of proof is on you :)

Telorand ,

I think there's a fundamental misunderstanding that people who use a Steam Deck only ever use it in Game Mode, and that's simply untrue.

This was my claim. To put it a different way, "All people who use a Steam Deck only ever use it in Game Mode." I am a person. The parent and children from the anecdote I shared are people. We all use Desktop Mode. Therefore, it is not true that all Steam Deck owners only use it in Game Mode.

I never made any other claims. Burden of proof met.

It is not my burden of proof to demonstrate the positive claim that an "extremely small" minority is using Desktop Mode. That's your claim, and the burden is upon you to prove it.

Sabata11792 ,
@Sabata11792@ani.social avatar

I switched my gaming PC to Nobara after seeing all my games run on the Deck. I may need to dual boot for a few but I haven't bothered setting the Windows install back up. Haven't missed VR enough yet.

Telorand ,

VR will probably catch up, too, as bigger devs start to realize they're leaving money on the table by ignoring a growing market.

Sabata11792 ,
@Sabata11792@ani.social avatar

I been hearing that it shouldn't be too far away, but I'm not holding my breath on it.

Telorand ,

I don't think we'll see meaningful changes until it at least has wider market adoption on Windows. It's still mostly a novelty at this point, even with the arrival of tech like the Apple Ski Goggles.

Screemu ,
@Screemu@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

Isn't that how most laptops are sold? People use Windows on them because they ship with Windows?

neidu2 , (edited )

True, but there isn't really much of a discussion of users moving TO windows, as using windows is, on a broader scale, the de facto default.

I'm curious how the linux share would be today if no PC ever was sold with a preinstalled OS.

Screemu ,
@Screemu@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

So then you too agree that moving TO has nothing to do with market share :)

neidu2 , (edited )

No, because I'm not making an argument for or against something, I'm pointing out that the discussion at hand is moot because there are two different goals being argued towards. Apples and oranges.

Screemu , (edited )
@Screemu@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

Well, you're arguing against the OP's title of the thread.

Edit: Weer een mooie reden om nog een andere arrogante en domme Hollander te blokkeren hier 😅 En je bent je comments aan het veranderen alsof niemand dat doorheeft.

Edit2: At this point I'm just gonna block this right wing community and their abuse.

neidu2 , (edited )

No. If you look carefully you will notice that the title is a question (hint: there's a question mark at the end). I joined a conversation that sought to answer that question. You, however, seem to be after an argument, in which case I suggest you find someone else. Especially if you want it in dutch as I do not speak the language.

Edit: Lol, what the fuck

Potatos_are_not_friends ,

I was going to argue against this but you have a point.

I was originally going to call out the Linux laptops selling worse, assuming that people were more comfortable with Windows.

But Chromebooks sold a LOT. So maybe the average consumer doesn't care as long as the laptop is easy to use.

HobbitFoot ,

People count Chromebooks as ChromeOS even though it is Linux.

synapse1278 ,
@synapse1278@lemmy.world avatar

ChromeOS is not counted as Linux for the same reasons Android isn't counted as Linux and MacOS isn't counted as BSD. Those are proprietary, locked-down operating systems. It contrasts with what is broadly understund as Linux, meaning Linux distributions that adhere to some kind of FOSS philosophy.

HobbitFoot ,

Apple sells Mac computers in part because of the OS.

Microsoft became a monopoly because it beat out most other OS vendors.

ChromeOS and Steam Decks are being sold, in part, due to the OS capabilities to run the software people like.

Carighan ,
@Carighan@lemmy.world avatar

Not really, it's been a while since laptops don't offer a choice for OS. Apple's overpriced crap excluded of course. You'll have to swap the OS after receiving that one.

wolf_2202 ,

How do posters know why people buy their steam decks? I bought my steam deck because it runs linux, so their initial argument is kind of a non-starter

Mango ,

No, we definitely choose the Steam Deck for Linux.

newthrowaway20 ,

Yeah I don't get the argument either. Sounds like some Microsoft-bros not wanting to see a 3rd option for OS'.

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