futurebird ,
@futurebird@sauropods.win avatar

In Oklahoma they are passing a law to mandate a Bible be in every classroom.

I don't have as much of an issue with this as I do with hanging the (Protestant Evangelical) ten commandments on the wall. The Bible, like many other religious texts is an important book...

Just one little question:

Which Bible?

Ya'll say "The Bible" like you have a Pope and there is only one. That's not true. So... which one?

If you don't know then maybe you are not qualified to make such mandates.

futurebird OP ,
@futurebird@sauropods.win avatar

Getting yelled at because of the copies of "Euclid's Elements" I put in every classroom.

I thought you said to "put the Bible!!"

futurebird OP ,
@futurebird@sauropods.win avatar

Let's have a whole little bookshelf that says "Bibles"

And everyone can bring whatever Bibles they like and add it to the Bible library.

LinuxAndYarn ,
@LinuxAndYarn@mastodon.social avatar

@futurebird How about a screenwriter's bible for Star Trek Discovery?

kingkaufman ,
@kingkaufman@sfba.social avatar
justafrog ,
@justafrog@mstdn.social avatar

@futurebird Would be Knuth's TAOCP if I had any say in it.

SehrLesbisch ,
@SehrLesbisch@chaos.social avatar
futurebird OP ,
@futurebird@sauropods.win avatar

Look to the ant, lazybones; consider her ways, and be wise:
She has no king, no boss, or ruler, but she knows to store her provisions in summer and plan for the harvest.

Proverbs 6:6-8

futurebird OP ,
@futurebird@sauropods.win avatar

I have a whole collection of all the mentions of ants in ancient texts and folklore. I could make that into an Ant Bible.

catselbow ,
@catselbow@fosstodon.org avatar

@futurebird

The bible does mention the anty christ.

emmanuelwald ,
@emmanuelwald@deacon.social avatar

@futurebird I would love to read that

mycotropic ,
@mycotropic@beige.party avatar

@futurebird

One of which I would buy the living heck out of!

NatureMC ,
@NatureMC@mastodon.online avatar

@futurebird When I wrote my much too long comment, I hadn't seen the comments here yet. So I used a different version of the Ant Bible. 😁

StephanMatthiesen ,
@StephanMatthiesen@troet.cafe avatar

@futurebird Oh yes please do write a book about ants in the Bible!

Also, when they want the Bible in each classroom, are they aware that Bible literally is the Greek word for "books"?

slothrop ,
@slothrop@chaos.social avatar

@futurebird Does she not have a queen, though?

futurebird OP ,
@futurebird@sauropods.win avatar

@slothrop

Queens do not "rule" the other ants. They are just the ant with the job of laying eggs.

It's really interesting to me that people in the Bronze age seemed to know this? Or at least recognized the autonomy of individual ants. And they also used the feminine pronouns for ant workers ... which is also correct.

futurebird OP ,
@futurebird@sauropods.win avatar

@slothrop

Before you say they didn't know that ants had queens... they did! There is a whole lovely story about King Solomon talking to a queen ant. The queen ant humbles the human King who has gotten too big of a head. It's a nice story.

slothrop ,
@slothrop@chaos.social avatar

@futurebird I wouldn’t dream of arguing about ants with you! 😇

regordane ,
@regordane@mastodon.me.uk avatar

@futurebird @slothrop

I'm pretty sure that story is a later legend, not in the Bible itself

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valley_of_the_ants

llewelly ,
@llewelly@sauropods.win avatar

@futurebird @slothrop
the use of the word "queen" for an egg-laying ant (or other hymenopteran) seems to encourage many misconceptions, particularly the idea that the "queen" has some special power of command, so it's interesting they seemed to know ant "queens" don't "rule" in the human sense. But they must have needed some understanding of ants to protect food stores.

LevZadov ,
@LevZadov@kolektiva.social avatar

@llewelly @futurebird @slothrop

"Queen" is not the right word. I nominate "Womb" to replace it.

llewelly ,
@llewelly@sauropods.win avatar

@LevZadov @futurebird @slothrop
the terms gyne and reproductive are already in use. "womb" would be problematical because it implies live birth, and most (all?) ants are egg layers. Anyone know of a an ant that gives live birth?

futurebird OP ,
@futurebird@sauropods.win avatar

@llewelly @LevZadov @slothrop

Though there are many insects and arthropods who give live birth, this isn't something that any hymenopterans will do.

melivia ,
@melivia@queer.party avatar

@futurebird @slothrop My first thought was to wonder how they knew that worker ants were female without a microscope—but workers do lay eggs occasionally, right?

futurebird OP ,
@futurebird@sauropods.win avatar

@melivia @slothrop

Workers do lay eggs. One could notice if you caught some worker ants of certain species and kept them separated from their colony. Without the queen they turn to laying eggs (which are unfertilized so they can only produce males) in a last ditch effort to participate in the nuptial flights.

But it might also just be a fluke, or a tendency to call all small creatures female? I don't know enough about language to say how remarkable it is to use female pronouns.

Metaph ,
@Metaph@dragon.style avatar

@futurebird @slothrop

This is interesting! (I can't say I realized that worker ants are female either :dragneyes: )

I do wonder (and maybe you know) if the choice of feminine pronoun for the ant here has more to do with the translator dealing with ancient Hebrew's grammatical gender. Perhaps the biblical Hebrew word for "ant" is just feminine?

(Not trying to reply guy or anything I am just a language nerd enjoying the thread and you seem both fairly knowledgeable and interested in details like this 💙)

Twotired ,
@Twotired@universeodon.com avatar

@futurebird @slothrop
I didn’t even realize until you wrote this that my unquestioned understanding has always been that the queen does rule. That assumption was based on… nothing? What a human queen means?

AndorianSoup ,
@AndorianSoup@mastodon.social avatar
nobilis ,
@nobilis@smutlandia.com avatar

@futurebird

A Jefferson Bible would be a good addition.

Jorsh ,
@Jorsh@beige.party avatar

@futurebird

brings a dogeared copy of George Carlin's Brain Droppings

NatureMC ,
@NatureMC@mastodon.online avatar

@futurebird Great idea!

MennoWolff ,
@MennoWolff@ohai.social avatar

@futurebird
Can I bring my Handbook Of Chemistry And Physics?
It's arguably THE bible for chemical engineering students.

lufthans ,
@lufthans@mastodon.social avatar

@futurebird Stevens/Comers TCP/IP books

catselbow ,
@catselbow@fosstodon.org avatar
Nicovel0 ,
@Nicovel0@mastodon.social avatar

@futurebird I would leave The Prokaryotes, but it’s a bit heavy

michael_w_busch ,
@michael_w_busch@mastodon.online avatar

@futurebird I have heard the CRC Handbook of Chemistry and Physics be called "the rubber bible" (because the CRC publishing group was originally the Chemical Rubber Company).

But I am not convinced that such creative responses actually do much to stop the authoritarian supremacists responsible for such outrages.

mensrea ,
@mensrea@freeradical.zone avatar

@futurebird and while we're at it maybe a quran and the vedas

Illuminatus ,
@Illuminatus@mstdn.social avatar

@futurebird A Saint Hyeronimus Vulgate. In Latin. Or you'll be known for the noob you are.

VirginiaHolloway ,

@futurebird That's one of the conundrums that puzzles me. If the Bible is the literal "word of God" as I understand some believe, then how can the words be different in different versions? I guess this is why we have sectarian wars, over those words. I'm sure it won't be too long before SCOTUS determines which version is the correct (joking/not joking).

SteveClough ,
@SteveClough@metalhead.club avatar

@VirginiaHolloway @futurebird Oh don't get onto that one. For many of them, it is the King James Version, which was written by God apparently.

Which proves that God is a terrible writer.

futurebird OP ,
@futurebird@sauropods.win avatar

@SteveClough @VirginiaHolloway

Isn't that the bible of The Church of England... and isn't that the church we Americans were so butt-hurt about having to be a member of that they all went over an ocean to escape it???

albnelson ,
@albnelson@lor.sh avatar

@futurebird @SteveClough @VirginiaHolloway I just like the idea of William Bradford and Increase Mather being butt-hurt. Explains a lot.

SteveClough ,
@SteveClough@metalhead.club avatar

@futurebird @VirginiaHolloway You expect it to make sense? That boat sailed a long time ago.

MennoWolff ,
@MennoWolff@ohai.social avatar

@futurebird @SteveClough @VirginiaHolloway
If i'm not mistaken the argument wasn't over what it says in the bible, that's the word of God, so duh. The argument was over what it says in the bible, what it really says, i.e. the interpretation.
But the bible says so many contradictory things, so it's not surprising some people get upset every once in a while.

CaffeinatedBookDragon ,
@CaffeinatedBookDragon@nerdculture.de avatar

@futurebird

You can have fun with "The Brick Bible" in classrooms... with the LEGOs and all, it'd definitely get picked up and looked at. Bonus is the pics and stories could lead to some awkward questions at home about what's actually IN the bible mommy and daddy keep on the shelf or table (hee hee).

dogzilla ,
@dogzilla@masto.deluma.biz avatar

@futurebird @nedhamson1 I have no problem with using the Jefferson Bible.

It’s amazing these idiots are so bigoted they can’t conceive of there being any other bible but the one they’re used to

FrankFrank ,
@FrankFrank@newsie.social avatar

@dogzilla @futurebird @nedhamson1

The X-rated Bible is hotter than tRUMP humping Stormy Daniel's in August at Death Valley. It's a corker.

https://archive.org/details/XRatedBibleBenEdwardAkerley/page/n90/mode/1up

futurebird OP ,
@futurebird@sauropods.win avatar

@FrankFrank @dogzilla @nedhamson1

This must be a use of "hot" that I'm not familiar with.

shadowsminder ,
@shadowsminder@mas.to avatar

@futurebird the Bible and the Ten Commandments must be taught, not only present.

However, this order for the Bible is a policy, not a law. That came from a memo by the superintendent of schools.

The Oklahoma Supreme Court is entirely unlike the US Supreme Court as it pushes back against the state's GOP movement to establish religion, specifically Evangelicalism, in schools.

Both the Bible and the Ten Commandments requirements will probably go to the court.

kingkaufman ,
@kingkaufman@sfba.social avatar

@futurebird

If I were a teacher there I would teach about nothing but the Sermon on the Mount.

OK, we're starting a 3-week unit on "Be careful not to practice your righteousness in front of others to be seen by them. If you do, you will have no reward from your Father in heaven."

Then we'll have 4 weeks on "Give to the one who asks you, and do not turn away from the one who wants to borrow from you."

And then we'll have 2 weeks on "Therefore I tell you, do not worry about your life, what you will eat or drink; or about your body, what you will wear. Is not life more than food, and the body more than clothes? 26 Look at the birds of the air; they do not sow or reap or store away in barns, and yet your heavenly Father feeds them," which is about infallibility, because if you've ever watched how hard birds work you know that Jesus didn't know fuck-all about birds, so what else was he ignorant about hmm?

Let's see, then 2 weeks on "Do not judge, or you too will be judged ..."

tadbithuman ,

@futurebird

There is not just one Pope either.

dnavinci ,
@dnavinci@genomic.social avatar

@futurebird
I was likewise wondering which 10 commandments they wanted, Exodus or Deuteronomy. Also I counted 17 last time. Which ones should we omit.

futurebird OP ,
@futurebird@sauropods.win avatar

@dnavinci

Human history and ancient texts are so cool... but the people doing this don't really care about this stuff.

aprilfollies ,
@aprilfollies@mastodon.online avatar

@futurebird @dnavinci “Their Bible’s not for reading, it’s for thumping!” -My Dad

MichaelPorter ,
@MichaelPorter@ottawa.place avatar
cshlan ,
@cshlan@dawdling.net avatar

@futurebird
I'd be bringing the Oxford Annotated Bible with the Apocrypha. I want those kids to see all the academic comments and know people argue about meaning and study context.

lienrag ,

@futurebird

Especially when Byblios means "book".

mycotropic ,
@mycotropic@beige.party avatar

@futurebird

The cannon of MC Hawking makes this point (A Brief History of Rhyme, Chapter 15) ;

"They need to read a book that ain't so damn old
Let reason take hold
Though truth to be told
They're probably already too far gone
Withdrawn, the conclusion foregone
But maybe there's still hope for the young
If they reject the dung being slung from the tongues
Of the ignorant fools who call themselves preachers
And listen instead to their science teachers"

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=89jt7zJzkNQ

NatureMC ,
@NatureMC@mastodon.online avatar

@futurebird 🧵 As a former student of Theology and Religious studies, I have a simple explication for which many Americans will hate me: THE bible doesn't exist. We only have different corpuses of text collections and translations.
Why?
(People who believe that God personally dictated even one of these collections of texts, please stop reading!)
I try to keep it simple: Just imagine: In earlier times, people passed on traditions orally. There is a tribe that is enthusiastic about the great

NatureMC ,
@NatureMC@mastodon.online avatar

@futurebird 🧵 ant queen by the river and tells stories about it around the campfire. For the children it is embellished like a fairy tale, on feast days an epic is recited. Mythical structures are created, including legends. The story of the ant queen is wandering. The tribe from the mountains doesn't know what a river is, and they adjust the landscape. The tribe that wanted to steal the ants only focused on ant eggs. And there is the tribe that makes war, speaks ill of the ant tribe and changes

NatureMC ,
@NatureMC@mastodon.online avatar

@futurebird 🧵 the history.
Later, people begin to write down important things. They find ant stories everywhere, are fascinated how many, and write them down. They themselves have never met the tribe, never seen ants. Every writer influences their choice, their way of writing.
A lot of time later, people fascinated by ants (but knowing not much) find some of these papyri. Many are nearly destroyed, so they try to reconstruct the texts. Sometimes they take pieces of several writers together.

BashStKid ,
@BashStKid@mastodon.online avatar

@futurebird Surely all those originalist thinkers should be preferring a Greek New Testament and a Hebrew/Aramaic Tanakh.

IngaLovinde ,
@IngaLovinde@embracing.space avatar

@futurebird "which bible?" all the most popular ones? So there should be copies of Quran, Vedas, King James', Torah, Adi Granth, Tao Te Ching, Book of Mormons, etc, in every classroom

ASprinkleofSage ,
@ASprinkleofSage@mastodon.social avatar

@futurebird Script to Monty Python's Life of Brian. Technically biblical. "He's having a go at the flowers now!"

jonquass ,
@jonquass@techhub.social avatar

@futurebird
Let's go with the Satanic Bible then!

sasyecat ,
@sasyecat@mstdn.social avatar

@futurebird
The only bible that should be in schools.

TheNovemberMan ,
@TheNovemberMan@bookstodon.com avatar
gibeath ,
@gibeath@mastodon.social avatar

@futurebird ... and once the theocrats get in power, they'll spin their wheels on the bullshit differences between them like a bad Marvel vs DC argument.

come to think of it that smells like opportunity

kellogh ,
@kellogh@hachyderm.io avatar

@futurebird whelp, fwiw, i think all branches of christianity and judaism all have a bible that contains the ten commandments. it’s the rare part of the bible that literally everyone agrees on

jgordon ,
@jgordon@appdot.net avatar

@futurebird Once SCOTUS ends church-state separation we get to see how well the Mormons and Baptists and Catholics really get along.

futurebird OP ,
@futurebird@sauropods.win avatar

@jgordon

That won't be a happy time. Baptists don't even get along with Baptists. I think the idiom is "Four Baptists? Six opinions."

Nazani ,
@Nazani@universeodon.com avatar

@futurebird @jgordon
Coming soon- the dispensationalist shootout at Clinton, Arkansas.

Probertd8 ,
@Probertd8@mastodonapp.uk avatar

@futurebird A gun and a Bible in every classroom - Republicans dream.

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