TheObviousSolution , (edited )

One thing is to tax the rich, another thing entirely is to tax what they haven't got "gains" on.

FreakinSteve ,

¿Porque no los dos?

Dasus ,

Yeah this.

Those numbers would be income taxation, but not capital gains taxation, and the really wealthy have most of their income as capital gains.

The more money you have, the more you have ways of avoiding taxes.

Which when I was young, used to be criminal. Now it's just rebranded.

ZILtoid1991 ,

Meanwhile in Hungary: if you're a large business, you pay less tax by percentage than small businesses and self-employed people.

Gabu ,

Isn't Hungary officially the most corrupt country in Europe?

Dicska ,

I think #1 in the EU and some strong place somewhere in the top 5 in Europe. It's gotten SO much worse in the past 10-15 years... And not like it was good before that, to begin with.

Gabu ,

Oh yeah, I'm aware - I had plans to move to Hungary, to get to know my ancestors' homeland. Completely scrapped it and won't even think about visiting until Orbán's head in on a pike and his whole party of cronies is exiled.

Fried_out_Kombi ,
@Fried_out_Kombi@lemmy.world avatar

https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/7181a59e-5ef6-49b3-8641-980b25aaf4a1.webp

I'm personally in favor of land value taxes, externality taxes, and natural resource severance taxes.

UnderpantsWeevil ,
@UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world avatar

Just take everything from the neck up.

Eximius ,

For billionaires: there is nothing there.

scroll_responsibly ,
@scroll_responsibly@lemmy.sdf.org avatar
Churbleyimyam ,

UK:

"We hide your billionaires money"

Quill7513 ,
@Quill7513@slrpnk.net avatar

Oh we do that in the US too. Turns out Idaho is a popular global tax haven

captainlezbian ,

We have a point where progressive taxation reverses and you get a refund

Savas ,

If you're not a billionaire and against this, you're pretty much a moron and if you're thinking one day you'll be a billionaire, you won't be based on your thought process alone.

There's no sensible reason why anyone should have no resistance accumulating that much wealth to themselves. It isn't infinite money for everyone, essentially you're taking it from others. Yes, some fools kind of deserve or are themselves at blame for parting from their own money, but if there are no stops, it doesn't motivate others from making sure they create methods to keep doing this to others. All to gain, nothing to lose.

Aux ,

Wut? No one taxes wealth because that doesn't work. This meme is plain wrong.

lemmyseikai ,

Nuh uhhn... If you tax me high as a millionaire I will never make it to billionaire. That's just math, duh. /s

FiskFisk33 ,

Wrong.
Those are income taxes for people with high salaries.

No billionaire earns the bulk of their money as taxable income. None of these countries tax billionaires the way the meme implies

artvabas ,

Oops, just found out that I have to pay tax😲😊

GissaMittJobb ,

Wow, this is just entirely wrong. Completely and utterly wrong.

Sweden has a maximum of around 55% income tax bracket if you're in a municipality with high income tax, but billionaires never are and as such would be taxed probably at most 50% income tax bracket.

This is of course entirely irrelevant because billionaires don't make their money on income. Sweden has fairly low capital gains taxes - 30% on regular accounts, and a special account that taxes the whole account value by a low percentage, which shakes out in average years to even lower taxes on capital. This assumes you even keep your capital in the country, which is a big if.

There's also no inheritance tax, no gift tax and no property tax. Sweden is actually an unusually good place to be a billionaire as far as taxation goes, and a below average place to earn a high salary as far as taxation goes.

cosmicrookie ,
@cosmicrookie@lemmy.world avatar

Dude... its a meme...

soggy_kitty ,

It's was just a prank bro calm down

TheBeege ,

Correct, but there are those that would take this as a source of truth and run with it. It's not the smart thing to do, but we already see people doing this sort of behavior on other social media.

We shouldn't enable the problem, even if it's an innocent mistake

cosmicrookie ,
@cosmicrookie@lemmy.world avatar

The point of the meme is to highlight that rich people should be taxed more

You can't include bracket taxing, asset taxing etc in a commit meme format.

If people get their facts off memes, they indeed have a problem but you can't accommodate for all who arent critical of their knowledge sources

GissaMittJobb ,

I don't buy this argument - if you're going to claim something to be the case, it should at least vaguely resemble the truth. Going by the 'rules' of this meme, Sweden should be right next to the U.S, or even take the U.S' place given that the U.S ranks better on wealth equality (not income equality where Sweden ranks better).

We should absolutely tax billionaires more. We should make memes about it to spread the word. We should also make those memes at least kind of accurate.

To understand one significant downside of this - Swedes reading this meme might think that we don't have a billionaire-taxation problem in our country. That's actively harmful to the cause.

FreakinSteve ,

You are correct one should never use a tactic that clearly worked for the opponent

frcl ,

Just because it's wrong, doesn't make it a joke.

UnrepententProcrastinator ,

Memes is how we got Trumpers.

joucker29 ,

Thanks for the info. Good to know.

KyuubiNoKitsune ,

Afaik it's 57%,or at least that's what they're taking of my bonus.

GissaMittJobb , (edited )

57% is the tax on "one-time gains" - bonuses and other such things.

This means that you're probably overpaying on it, but you might also be underpaying on your income taxes (usually ~30% even if you reach the ~50%-tax bracket). Worst case scenario, you've lent some money interest-free to the government that you get back on your tax returns.

Fenrisulfir ,

You can borrow from someone else. When someone else borrows from you, you lend it. Or lent as the past tense

lemmyseikai ,

Ish...

They could have said "you have let the government borrow from you tax free."

But yeah, the general idea holds.

GissaMittJobb ,

Thanks, updated. I think my mistake stems from Swedish only having one word for the concept, regardless of the direction of the transaction.

Fenrisulfir ,

I’ve noticed a lot of my european friends doing the same

GreyEyedGhost ,

I think the only english-speaking people in North America who know this read Hamlet in high school.

Fenrisulfir ,

Are people not reading Hamlet in high school now? What was the cutoff for 16th century literature, 2021?

cqthca ,

Like PE, it's all optional now.

UnderpantsWeevil ,
@UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world avatar

Sweden has fairly low capital gains taxes - 30% on regular accounts,

That's twice the American rate.

Telodzrum ,

Thanks to fairly recent changes by guess who!

SoleInvictus ,
@SoleInvictus@lemmy.world avatar

Wait, The Guess Who are in politics now?!

/Old man joke

Kage520 ,

I think it caps at 20% doesn't it?

UnderpantsWeevil ,
@UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world avatar

I think 28% for short term gains, but a meager 15% for long term gains.

cqthca ,

My only question is: Is there a limit to one person's power?

loudWaterEnjoyer ,
@loudWaterEnjoyer@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

No billionaire in Germany pays 47% income tax haha

mellowheat , (edited )

Billionaires in Europe "evade" taxes just like every other billionaire. Most of their wealth is assets, which is why their tax rates don't seem right if you don't understand how economics works.

cosmicrookie ,
@cosmicrookie@lemmy.world avatar

You still pay tax of assets though..

soggy_kitty ,

Hahahahaha you're funny

maynarkh ,

In the NL you do, there is a wealth tax. IDK how effective it is, but at least they are trying.

CrowAirbrush ,

It's effective in getting momey from the wealthier middle class. Like most of the tax related ruling and laws.

maynarkh ,

I think what limits its effectiveness is mostly that it's only the NL doing it. If it was EU wide, or even US-wide, the world would change a lot.

Even if it's not perfect now, I see that it is good that this tax exists for two reasons:

  • At least it's not taxing wages or consumption, which affect everyone but billionaires.
  • It serves as a model for going in that direction, so neolibs can't easily say there is no way to tax assets, or that taxing assets would crash the economy.
chiliedogg ,

The property tax rate where I'm at is 1.7%, and the appraisal districts WAY undervalue properties. A house will sell for 5 million in the city where I work, and their value on the tax roll is $300,000.

qjkxbmwvz ,

As others have pointed out, this is pretty disingenuous. Some (all?) of the others are quoting marginal tax rates --- and the US stacks up nicely on this front, at least in progressive states: max federal marginal tax rate is 37%, with California having a 14.4% max marginal rate. So apples to apples, the US would be 51.4%.

The problem, obviously, is that nowhere in the world do billionaires make their money through "normal" income.

Jimmycrackcrack ,

What's the image in the bottom left from?

swunchy ,

All the frames are from the movie "We're the Millers"

Jimmycrackcrack ,

Oh. Haha I've seen this image a lot but for some reason all the other panels looked familiar to me as part of some movie I'd seen but forgotten about and this one seemed like the odd one out. Turns out they're all from a movie I've ever heard of.

acetanilide ,

This scene is worth watching

The rest of it... I'm not so sure

tacosanonymous ,

I watched the whole thing. No regerts

HootinNHollerin ,

Start the head tax

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