space_gecko ,

When I graduated college, I was interviewing with the charter school that my mom works at. They were looking for ANYBODY with a degree in physics. It didn't matter that I wasn't a licensed educator, it didn't matter that all I had was a Bachelor's degree. They were offering an annual salary of $42,000 per year.

Two years later, I'm making over 4x that amount, annually, as a software engineer.

I really would love to teach, because I love science and I love teaching. But I love financial stability and a good work/life balance wayyy more.

Bakkoda ,
@Bakkoda@sh.itjust.works avatar

My dream would be to coach full time. I've interviewed with colleges (smallish and local) and it might as well be volunteer since it's not football or basketball. Damn shame.

cqthca ,

Same. be a part time math tutor. It pays well ($50+/hr & you're under no one's thumb) for trig and you filter for generally interested students.

BmeBenji ,

Teachers in America are paid and treated like absolutely noone cares about them. Without them, prisons would be even more overpopulated, the wealth gap would be a wealth chasm, events of bigotry would skyrocket, parents would have to pay for daycare, children would go without lunch, etc. Honestly I have a hard time imagining anything in this shithole getting significantly better without improving funding for teachers and schools. However, I think that’s the exact reason they aren’t funded-better.

wanderingmagus ,

You mean everything you mention isn't already happening in multiple states?

spujb OP ,

love forcing words into another’s mouth, it’s my favorite thing to do online

wanderingmagus ,

"Without them" implied that with them (status quo) the consequences listed would not be occurring.

spujb OP ,

goodness gracious. each phrase following “without them” was a phrase describing a growth scenario of something that already exists:

  • “would be even more overpopulated”
  • “would skyrocket”
  • “wealth gap” -> “wealth chasm”

…implying that with the status quo the consequences listed would still be occurring, but stating that without teachers it would be worse. please. ohmygosh.

without teachers reading comprehension would dive out of control but it’s already pretty bad. 😪😪😪

wanderingmagus ,

How about

parents would have to pay for daycare, children would go without lunch, etc.

? Are parents not already forced to pay for daycare, children not already going without lunch?

Edit:formatting

spujb OP , (edited )

bruh. okay nitpick that then instead of saying

you mean everything (emphasis mine) you mention isn’t already happening in multiple states?

and maybe you’d get a helpful answer like as follows:

in most cases in US education, school serves multiple functions in addition to education, including taking care of kids during business hours (childcare) and feeding them one meal a day (in some cases; lunch). in the top level comment, the poster intended to express that, if all teachers/schools disappeared in a hypothetical thanos-snap scenario, all parents would be forced to cover the additional costs of watching their kids while they are away at work and of paying for that additional lunch.

such a scenario is entirely unrelated to current tragedies wherein children are going without lunches due to school board decisions, because, again, this is a hypothetical expressing the labor done by educators. the point is teachers are good things, and commenter makes that point by saying how without teachers things are worse. no one ever said things aren’t already bad, but that’s the assumption you made for some reason.

wanderingmagus ,

Shipmate, I'm pointing out that the system as it already stands is pretty much exactly as shit as they say it would become should the situation change. Each attempt to merely increase wages here and there is like putting a bandage on a gangrenous wound or a tumor, instead of realizing that the tumor itself needs to be surgically removed for all these symptoms - the American prison system, for-profit childcare, normalized hunger as a punishment for poverty and so on - to be actually treated. Believe it or not, I'm on your side.

spujb OP ,

see my edit. and i don’t know what shipmate means.

wanderingmagus ,

Force of habit from almost a decade in the Navy, it's a term of "endearment" that was intended by politicians and bureaucrats to be a "polite" term that can be universally applied regardless of rank, but is usually applied out of exasperation when actual insult isn't warranted. Apologies for the unfamiliar term.

spujb OP ,

oh lol i thought it was some chess reference i somehow was unaware of

wanderingmagus ,

It would totally make sense for some sailor to use it that way too after a night on liberty in port, but alas no.

spujb OP ,

thanks for the clarification :) i believe you are on my side but im still gonna maintain that you badly maligned the meaning of the commenter’s post lol. i put the remainder of my thoughts here

BmeBenji ,

My dad has told me multiple times “teachers unions are the worst thing that has happened to teachers.”

Someone very close to me is a teacher and I don’t think I’ll be able to stand hearing him say it again.

spujb OP ,

thats so enraging im so sorry

We generally find that the preponderance of empirical evidence suggests that teacher unionization and union strength are associated with increases in district expenditures and teacher salaries, particularly salaries for experienced teachers. Cowen and Strunk

BmeBenji ,

He claims to understand the plight of teachers because his mom was a high school guidance counselor 50 years ago and his sister was a tutor/substitute teacher 15 years ago. He’s 100% out of touch and if that wasn’t already clear, he told me that he didn’t believe there was a teacher shortage.

cqthca ,

Autodidact here. If one has drive, and a >20Mb internet connection and even a ten year old computer, one can teach oneself Mechanical Drafting, Excel & Access (or other spreadsheet & relational database, like libre office suite).
Here is my advice to any driven young person, like 16 with a car.

  • get your GED/HiSET
  • if you are into trades, like the South Park episode showed is gonna be jackin', is apprenticeship.gov
  • if you are into free college, modernstates.org
  • if you want to start a business, sba.gov

I went with finishing public HS till 18, instead of jumping out with a GED or HiSET at 16, getting an apprenticeship (mechanical drafting) & doing that put me 2 years behind the ones that did this, and like AI, those are two important years, like the Pink Floyd song, Time...

And then one day you find

Two years have got behind you

No one told you when to run

You missed the starting gun

cqthca ,

It's a good deal if you live till ninety and retire at 65. The one in my family is rolling along at her same payrate each month (adjusted COLA) as she had when she left, and since inflation has been under control, generally, it's like her pay was effectively doubled. Every month she gets a Direct Deposit for the amount she would have got if she were still working, 25 years of that and she only worked for 20.... UNIONS!

BmeBenji ,

Full disclosure I don’t think anyone who has started teaching in the last 10-20 years will live to 90 if they continue teaching until they retire. The stress alone is likely to take a decade or two off their life.

cqthca ,

yeah, mom lived in the 'golden era of teaching' where the parents backed the teachers

Kit ,

I pay $3500/year in school taxes. Teachers are in poverty while administration makes well into six figures, and climbing. Make it make sense.

cqthca ,

Was it that Bush II started 'no child left behind' and it has grown into a bureaucratic monster?

jordanlund ,
@jordanlund@lemmy.world avatar

I loved teaching. I went broke doing it, but I loved it.

dditty ,
@dditty@lemm.ee avatar

Same. Might consider going back in the future but probably not.

spujb OP ,

this is what is so heartbreaking! teachers are what we thought doctors were growing up. i don’t know one who isn’t so intensely passionate and loving towards their students and work.

and the despicable cost-cutting system recognizes that and decides to simply take advantage of it. “the most passionate individuals are willing to do the job for the least pay? easy business decision.”

and when yall manage to scrape together a union we’ll further blame student issues on teachers’ failures, and not school leadership’s failures to partake in collective bargaining, a process so well entrenched in society that most other industries are able to do it without even coming close to a strike.

sorry im worked up over this, don’t know if you could tell lol

jordanlund ,
@jordanlund@lemmy.world avatar

What ended up making me quit was the bureaucracy. The low pay, on it's own, was awful, but I was willing to put up with it.

Getting screamed at by some office worker because they didn't like how I chose to fill out an attendance report made me go "This is not worth it. I'm better than this."

I was making $16.50 an hour teaching in the early 2000s. I'm now making just under $70 an hour working in the profession I was teaching.

cqthca ,

Part time math tutor for trig & algebra [or higher] you can get $50+/hr working 1099 for yourself. [might start lower, bc remembering now was able to jack up the rate bc the recommendations]

cqthca ,

as a former student, there are some bad apples in public schools, and I mean teachers, administrators, coaches & janitors.

Brunbrun6766 ,
@Brunbrun6766@lemmy.world avatar

It's not just the pay.

It's also the constant walking on eggshells about every single topic

Administrators controlling how teachers run their classroom

Discipline being relegated to the teachers taking time away from teaching

Open communication between parents and teachers being abused with no help from administration

Lack of resources to properly cover certain topics

Lack of programs to properly educate different types of students in ways they need, ways that a traditional classroom environment doesn't provide.

Source: Former teacher

spujb OP ,

wow thank you for sharing this :)

FurtiveFugitive ,

I would say 10 years ago it probably would have been mostly a pay issue. Now, all the teachers I know, a raise wouldn't be enough to right the ship. Teaching to the test, no child left behind, the ever increasing behavior problems with no real way to stop it, the list goes on and on.

Brujones ,

This is spot on. A family member of mine is a high school teacher and faces everything you laid out. I'd add the seemingly constant threats of lawsuits and violence to further illustrate the untenable atmosphere.

cqthca ,

violence?

masquenox ,

You know what would help a lot (in the long run, at least)?

If teachers could teach kids how to unionize so that it's not an alien concept to them when they leave school.

cqthca ,

Local School Board: It's bad enough you Teachers are unionized, don't spread the pinko propaganda to our dear christian childrens

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