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M0oP0o

@M0oP0o@mander.xyz

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M0oP0o ,
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done

M0oP0o ,
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Never even heard of one in my country. Recruiters are rarely seen outside at all.

M0oP0o ,
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It is tradition.

Why MAGA Loves Russia and Hates Ukraine ( www.nytimes.com )

As I type this newsletter, continued American aid for Ukraine is in grave doubt. Tucker Carlson is in Moscow to conduct a friendly interview with Vladimir Putin. And we’re receiving reports from the front lines that Russia is advancing, in part because of Ukrainian ammunition shortages. In short, the war is reaching a critical...

M0oP0o ,
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I hear the moon is nice in this regard. Not really a country but hard vacuum seems to do wonders.

M0oP0o ,
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I am not sure of all the posters here, you would want to mention "throwing a tantrum" in regards to being wrong. But hey I for one am a fan of your posts, it has been fun reading.

M0oP0o , (edited )
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Yeah, I am going to have to disagree after reading though your over 50 posts here. You point is in tatters, you are grasping at straws and the funniest part is you seem to flat out ignore anything that does not help your argument. You have many times been semantic and then when proven wrong on semantics proceeded to say you are not arguing semantics. Same deal with legality, and when asked if you have a moral argument, you deflect or ignore.

Like I said, I am a fan of your posts here. I get a chuckle when people double down over and over.

M0oP0o ,
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I’m glad you’re getting a chuckle but I suspect that your delight stems more from who you are as a person rather than anything I’ve actually said.

Oh nice ad-hominem. That would be the correct way of doing ad-hominem by the way.

Oh and since your augment is not moral, semantic or legal how is it not also "irrelevant"?

M0oP0o ,
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Again, I don’t care. You’re still starving.

Ha, This was a lot of keystrokes to not care. And yes, this is delicious dessert after my morning coffee.

M0oP0o ,
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Not really. I’m a fast typer. Still don’t care.

Not sure what is funnier, that you think this is a counterpoint or that you care that people think you don't care about a topic you have made the greatest amount of comments in.

M0oP0o ,
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I think it’s telling that you found that to be an ad-hominem when I made no attack about you whatsoever.

Yes, "telling" as if people can not understand basic veiled implications.

M0oP0o ,
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Since your augment is not moral, semantic or legal how is it not also “irrelevant”?

M0oP0o ,
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You being pompous and overly verbose makes you look bad.

Oh another good ad-hominem, also I think maybe projection in this case.

M0oP0o ,
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your delight stems more from who you are as a person rather than anything I’ve actually said.

Sorry I take it back, this is not even veiled. Oh and mind addressing the basis of your argument? I want to know the not moral, legal or semantic argument.

M0oP0o ,
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Introducing pedantry to the mix isn’t useful or helpful.

I agree.

You should also take your own advice and address the actual argument and points made.

M0oP0o ,
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Nice try dodging, my point is you have said anything you don't like is "irreverent" to this argument as you are not making a moral, legal, or semantic argument. So if not one of these 3 what is your point based on other then a wordy version of "nuh uh"

M0oP0o ,
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Ok, then copy the answer here as I can not find it and you are such a fast typer that even if you don't care you will still respond.

M0oP0o ,
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Ok... now we know you are being disingenuous and not arguing in good faith. You (unless you are not reading these) just admitted to being overly verbose, pompous and that it makes you look bad. Also that you are making ad-hominem arguments while trying to claim other arguments/points are wrong because they are ad-hominem.

I must bow in this display of wordsmithing, as you have done all this in just 2 words.

M0oP0o ,
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Ok? I don’t think I did but does that really matter? The point still stands whether I used the idiom correctly or not.

Yes, that does matter. That would be the whole point of the idiom.

For example if I tried to argue a king can command the tide, and then used King Canute and the tide to prove my point, I would not only be not making my point stand but also confusing the crap out of everyone.

M0oP0o ,
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My point is in asking people to simply admit that they are stealing when pirating something. Otherwise, piracy would not be a thing. There’d be no reason for the word “piracy” as the acquisition of the content would not matter if it was something other than a form of theft.

And here is the fun part, you have been soundly and completely shown that piracy (software) is not stealing or theft in the semantic, legal and even moral sense. You even help others arguments with your "irrelevant" approach to any counterpoint by stating that is not the argument you are making. Then you also call anyone who engages with you "dishonest" without the slightest indication or example of dishonesty.

M0oP0o ,
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Not even a hint? Maybe it is metaphysical? I have been though your comments here and have yet to find out what type of argument yours is.

M0oP0o ,
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Ok… and?

In response to:

You being pompous and overly verbose makes you look bad.

Oh another good ad-hominem, also I think maybe projection in this case.

I did not think I would have to explain what projection is in this context.

I insulted them because they were not actually addressing the argument. The insults were intended in what I wrote to them precisely because they weren’t making an argument against what I was saying. They were being dismissive and I was returning that dismissiveness in kind.

Oh and my point about your insulting people while trying to shut down arguments was that you are being a hypocrite and that further hurts your argument/point. You claiming someone is being "dismissive" by not agreeing with you is not really the defence you likely think it is.

M0oP0o ,
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Who said I ignored or misrepresented your argument? This is the first time you have brought this particular accusation and I am somewhat interested in how you came to such a conclusion. I am clearly not ignoring you or your argument (I am still waiting for you to finish defining it after all) and other then quotes from you I have hardly even started to represent, let alone misrepresent you.

I think once again we can look at the many people you call dishonest as a form of projection.

M0oP0o ,
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You guys are all bending over backwards to defend the very thing that is keeping the situation the way it is and forcing creators to work for these giant distributors. We’re literally using the internet, a place where creators can self-publish their content, and you guys are pretending that piracy is not theft. It’s madness.

The very thing keeping the situation the way it is very much not piracy or can it be placed at the feet of the general consumer. That you think the mess of giant distributors we have today is the fault of digital piracy is actually madness.

M0oP0o ,
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If you did watch it, then it’s stealing.

This is the hottest of takes and by the same logic I will claim your eyeballs are now violating me by the act of reading this.

The issue that you seem to miss is that for someone to steal something, someone has to lose something.

Here is an example:

Sue has a dog, Jim walked up and took the dog. Sue does not have a dog anymore. <--- This is stealing/theft ect.

Sue has a dog, Jim walked up and used a device to make a perfect copy of the dog and then gave the copy away. Sue still has a dog. <--- This is software piracy.

M0oP0o ,
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Thank you, well put. I would argue about your stance that copying is wrong a bit though. I think the issue is the distribution compainies role in a digital market makes little or no market sense currently. In the past it was very costly to distribute media (tape, LPs, dvd etc.) and bootleg copies also incurred a cost to the bootlegger. Now there is very little cost in distribution (server space being cheap) and little to no cost to make copies.

This has already been to the US courts (assuming people want the US option) with the VHS tape recording panic, and the courts found it was perfectly legal to make copies if you did not sell them or make profit from their use. That also included lending a buddy a copy (remember mixed tapes?), but now we all have the ability to share almost any media with a few billion of our closest friends.

The issue I think is that the current model does not work under today's reality and instead of adapting (like how most music artists only really make money touring or how popular online services became with most companies ) we have the current situation of crunchy roll (who does not make the product) having an outsized role in people's private property (media in this case).

M0oP0o ,
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True, if you count each and every time you stopped typing....

No, that is a bit mean and untrue. You have replied to many points, some of them even without calling the person "dishonest" or saying their point is "irreverent"

M0oP0o ,
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I feel that creators deserve to get paid for the work they create and piracy deprives them of that and is, therefore, theft

We covered this already, by that logic not consuming also deprives them and is, therefore, theft.

And I’m not arguing any of the legalities of it. I don’t care about the distinction of theft and copyright infringement in a legal sense. I’m care about the practical effects of stealing something without paying for it.

If not legal what is the distinction? The practical effects are not the same as stealing, as has been covered before. I can no more steal something simply by viewing it with my eyes then you can argue a definition that is not legal, semantic or moral.

This is not true. The creator loses something. You may want to talk about specific situations where a creator is hired on a “for work” basis to create something and we could argue that ad infinitum but then you’d need to make the distinction about where the line is drawn. Is it ok only when it’s work for hire? If so, why is not ok when it’s not? Where do you make the distinction?

The creator does not in fact lose something, this is the core of the counter arguments against your position. There is no point in "drawing a line" if non of this is in fact stealing. If you can see a sports event though your window even when you have not paid for a ticket that is not "stealing".

That’s irrelevant. If you weren’t going to buy it then you’re not entitled to consume it either.

This is not at all how a market works. It is in fact the direct opposite in reality. The creation of "black" markets is directly related to the consumers ability/desire to pay the normal market price. If there is a cheaper/free/easier alternative then it would be stranger for this not to happen. Netflix beat (past tense) piracy not by anything other then convenience.

I have never argued, here or otherwise, that piracy isn’t justified in some cases. I’m only arguing that, even when it’s justified, it’s still theft and that we should be honest about that.

I will agree you have not argued the justification, but that does not make piracy theft.

M0oP0o , (edited )
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Because that is how markets work. You would not buy a doughnut if you had access to them for free (say in a workplace). By this logic you are stealing every time you don't pay for something making literally every interaction or lack of interaction a monetary transaction or theft.

M0oP0o ,
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Their prices are not affected by piracy at all because you can’t pirate the Steelbooks themselves.

My limited metalworking experience says otherwise....

M0oP0o ,
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You have not. I brought up a foundational argument that you have yet to refuse. You just keep repeating their different as if it’s a factual statement, completely ignoring that I’ve pointed out a fundamental way in which they are not that is outside of any legal or semantic meaning.

We have, over and over. Software piracy is not theft in the legal, semantic, or moral sense. You have done nothing to prove it is fundamentally theft other then repeatably say it is. Hell you don't even define what it is you are arguing, you talk about potential loss of creators but then just gloss over all the insane implications that train of logic has. You say its theft but not willing to argue over the legal, literal or moral meaning of the word.

Please provide some foundational argument, because I have not seen anything that would not make our world even more of a laughably absurd corporate hellscape then it already is.

M0oP0o ,
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It is not. We’re simply disagreeing on what is being stolen. You’re arguing that, because the media itself isn’t stolen (it is infinitely reproducible), it’s not theft. I’m arguing that it’s income that’s being stolen.

We are disagreeing on the definition of "stolen". Your argument is insane because it implies you can steal potential in a real way. This is incredibly problematic as you are now saying anytime some entity does not make all the money/trade/exposure someone has stole that from them.

M0oP0o ,
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Yeah, the downvotes in here scream of “I can’t refute your point, so I’m just going to downvote you!”

Yes, if we all ignore the multiple times the point in question has been refuted.

M0oP0o ,
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I think the underlying issue is that the digital product is by its nature infinitely copyable and requires a different system/approach then the old physical distribution model. I don't think digital creators are today struggling for ways to monetize their work, but having issues convincing consumers of the value of that work. People are getting squeezed and it is changing how much (or even if) they spend on entertainment, art, etc. A major part about anything's value that keeps getting overlooked (by companies, creators, and often experts) is that the consumer does ultimately decide what that value is. With something that can be endlessly copied with little to no cost the assigned value drops, and we see in this current economic space more and more. Piracy is nothing but a byproduct of tech and market forces. I don't really think it is necessarily harmful or the core issue. I don't think gov bailouts are the fault of piracy, and more so using Nintendo as an example of a victim steels me in the other direction. As for the definition of theft, as has been said over and over here, it is not outdated and is very, very scary to think of the implications of a world where the definition is changed to include software piracy.

I get that it sucks being on the shit end of a shift in spending habits (hell, I sell drugs for a living and see the reduction in recreational spending firsthand). But to think that people are going to not bootleg, pirate, blackmarket trade, make knockoffs or such is, has and always be naive.

M0oP0o ,
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I looked into the wii thing a bit and I don't think it was the R4s and what not that had them not release the wii in Korea (at least not until 2019 for some odd reason). They released it in Brazil for shits sake, if risk of piracy was an issue I don't think they would have. I think the reason they did not release in Korea in a timely was just an odd choice (the wii had a few of them) and I would assume the same rational for the gamecube also not releasing in Korea. If it had something to do with piracy then I can assure you places like Brazil (November 26, 2013), Mexico (November 29, 2012) or South Africa (November 30, 2012) would also not see these consoles.

Actually now that I am thinking on it did South Korea not until fairly recently have a ban on Japanese electronics or media? Maybe the old Japan/Korea relations play a role in Nintendo's neglect?

This whole rabbit hole was neat, and thanks for that. However I do think this is a great example of a folk tale or rumour becoming the foundation of an idea that is just not actually true but feels true. And in time these examples used over and over become accepted as true, like the effectiveness of allied bombing in ww2 or that Margret Thatcher somehow invented soft-serve ice cream 20 years after it became popular. I don't think piracy is always harmless, but honestly in the grand picture of the world today I would say it is mostly harmless and so far down the list of "things to solve". Re-esablishing basic property rights to non rich people is much higher and even then I doubt it is in the top 100.

M0oP0o ,
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But, hear me out; Poop buckets.

M0oP0o ,
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Those dead, cold eyes....

M0oP0o OP ,
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Its more about the normalization of having your info then making money off of it.

M0oP0o ,
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HA! They would not even pay $1 for moving expenses when they asked me to move across the country. This was 8 plus years ago and not only was the offer no extra money, it was the same money in a more remote, colder, and higher cost of living area.

M0oP0o ,
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Well at least when I was there IBM managers where managing multiple teams across different cities.

They had the same made up issue years ago as well. I think I went to the office maybe once or twice a year, then all of a sudden, every Friday was "Think Friday" and we had to sit in a big room and hear some sales person talk nonsense about cloud, agile development and how soon field technicians would be ditching their clipboards for digital solutions (this was a good 20 years after every tech in IBM had stopped using paper fyi).

IBM just wants to get rid of more people and this is their plan.

Or as it was in the past, IBM is in the business of getting out of business, and that business is good.

M0oP0o ,
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What?! Weed is popular? When did this happen.......

M0oP0o ,
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This articles title is doing more dodging then Neo in the matrix, It is a bill making it legal to shoot a type of person if found outside their assigned ghetto. Not using the word "bum", "homeless" or "camper" is doing no one favours other then to obfuscate the reality of this.

M0oP0o ,
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They clam a credit to using AI to make the thumbnail..... The same people who did nothing more then ask Chat GPT to make a picture to represent the article on a tool that poisons AI models to protect people who make pictures for a living from having Chat GPT use their work to make; say a picture to represent an article on a tool that poisons AI models......

M0oP0o Mod ,
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https://mander.xyz/pictrs/image/b407219f-db83-430b-b26f-aa505d4d8512.jpeg

M0oP0o Mod ,
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At least the power is still on.

M0oP0o Mod ,
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Loving this weeks challenge.

Prompt:
"Sailor moon as Office worker of the future: The Atomic Secretary. In a 1960s thunderbirds sci-fi style. There is a toy spaceship hanging on a string with a lit sparkler on it." In the bingilator 13 tries and messing with the words.

https://mander.xyz/pictrs/image/674fe4a5-fee9-45a1-98b9-38b1dd8d9ff2.jpeg

Other neat ones not in the running:

https://mander.xyz/pictrs/image/a33d4afe-616b-4e87-ae4e-f412f29bf37d.jpeg
https://mander.xyz/pictrs/image/3392b95c-814b-43a1-9051-cb38fb91f542.jpeg
https://mander.xyz/pictrs/image/4d07ca9d-1daf-4242-85a7-b79a10fc6f3f.jpeg
https://mander.xyz/pictrs/image/2b956fb7-ce82-4a13-96fe-e36dae3f8744.jpeg
https://mander.xyz/pictrs/image/c839007f-2634-4102-8b8d-9cee8932c747.jpeg
https://mander.xyz/pictrs/image/1d469277-9199-49bc-aebf-4738409d6634.jpeg

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